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Why do I bother? I don’t know, but after talking to LC Jackboot last night, I really need to get this off of my chest. Then I’ll just go back to not giving a damn, since it’s painfully obvious where this country is headed by now and, as somebody who was born European, I can tell you that I know better than most what the destination is like, because I used to live there.
Anyway, as JB and I were talking about, there seems to be one huge logical disconnect going on among a large part of the voters in this country, and that is a complete lack of understanding of how politicians function, particularly when it comes to voting for McSwine.
First off, I understand “compromise”, I also understand “give and take” and I know full well that sometimes you have to compromise to get some of what you want. But voting for McCain isn’t “compromise”, its proper name is “abject surrender.”
What’s in it for me? The answer is “nothing.”
At some point, you have to say “stop! No further!” The thing is, we should’ve done that a long time ago, but instead we kept reinforcing bad behavior by rewarding it. I don’t know what kind of magical, wishful thinking it is that makes people think that rewarding scum for drifting to the left is going to one day, miraculously, make them turn around and drift the other way. I don’t know what the proper name for it is, but I’m certain that the word “pathological” is part of it.
Nobody, and certainly nobody who has ever been a parent can convince me that they believe that pap. If you let junior get away with raiding the cookie jar because “it could’ve been worse, he could’ve raided the bank account”, you’re NOT going to convince him that raiding the cookie jar is bad. Quite to the contrary. And eventually he WILL step up to raiding the bank account by snatching your check card. But I suppose you could then say “oh well, that’s bad, but he COULD have burned down the house, so we’ll let him off the hook for this one too.”
There is one thing that a lot of people need to realize, and nobody knows this better than somebody who has experienced socialism first hand. Not that it’s particular to socialist politicians, it’s just more obvious where they are concerned: No politician, I repeat NO politician, regardless of stripe, is in politics “for the good of the people/nation.” They’re in politics for the good of themselves, period. Being politicians is their job, just as being a plumber is somebody else’s job, and they’ll do anything and say anything, ANYTHING, to keep their jobs.
Don’t ever fool yourselves into thinking that you can somehow convince them to mend their ways by rational argument or appealing to their morals, because morals and logic don’t enter into it. For one thing, they don’t possess the former and probably wouldn’t know what the Hell you were talking about. No amount of “reasoning” and “appeal to morals” is going to make them do anything that doesn’t also happen to also be what they consider the thing most likely to keep them in a job. Remember the Amnesty debacle of last year?
If anybody here thinks that they backed down because we “convinced” them with our superior arguments, they’re fooling themselves. The only, ONLY thing that made them re-think their position were the polls indicating that quite a few of them would be out of a sinecure if they didn’t. That’s it. The ONLY way to get the attention of a politician is to make them fear for their fat, lazy, incumbent “jobs.”
And the ONLY way you can make them fear for their jobs is by letting them know that you’re not going to vote for them. If you say “OK, I’ll vote for you because you’re the lesser evil, but I want you to know that you’re getting to be on my last nerve here and that you really need to change your ways”, the politician you’re talking to won’t hear a word of what you’re saying after “I’ll vote for you because you’re the lesser evil…” And from this he’ll draw the following conclusions:
1) I can continue doing what I’m doing because my job is safe.
2) “The lesser of two evils” seems to work as a tactic, so I’ll just have to use that one in every election from now on.
That’s it. That is ALL that a politician will remember. The rest is just you flapping your gums, and if you really, honestly believe that he gives two shits about what you say as long as you keep voting for him, then you have absolutely no idea how politicians operate. Nor is he going to change.
Why would he? He’s getting to do what he wants to do with no consequences whatsoever. Why on EARTH would he start doing what he really DOESN’T want to do for no additional benefit? Your gratitude? Ha! He doesn’t give a flying fuck at a rolling donut for how you feel or what you would “like” unless NOT giving you what you would like might result in him having to give up his chosen career and go find a real job.
And that’s the bottom line: Unless a politician, ANY politician, sees his walking papers in front of him unless he does what you say, he’s going to do exactly what he wants to do. The more you let him get away with, the more he’ll try to get away with in the future.
Sorry, but that’s the way it is.
All that being said, I’m still not telling you what you should think or who you should vote for. That’s your choice. I just don’t want anybody to be deluding themselves into thinking that anything short of a threat of dismissal will somehow, miraculously, turn a politician around at some unspecified point in the future, because it’s not going to happen.
He’s got your vote. That’s all that you have that he needs from you. As long as he has that, everything else about you, your opinions, hopes, dreams, beliefs and principles are utterly irrelevant to him. He doesn’t give a shit about those, because they don’t keep him in perks, pork, bribes and benefits. Your vote does.
Thatisall.
I suspect what happend to the republican party is what happens to a gas in a vacuum. As the dems were forced farther and farther to the left the republicans moved farther left to take up the newly vacated area. They should have stayed put and seen what else would arise. A new democrat party that is still socialist but at least sane perhaps. Now the vacuum is starting to take place to the right of the republican party. Think they will move back to the right to regain lost voters? I doubt it.
May 13th, 2008 at 9:45 AMUsing
McCain to pick Hucabee as VP??
http://www.usnews.co.....-list.html
May 13th, 2008 at 10:18 AMUsing
What I consistently fail to hear from those who say “Gotta vote for the old fart … imagine how bad things would be if he didn’t win?” is this - what happens as a result of a McVain presidency? I can tell you right now we’re not going to get SC nominees like Alito or Roberts … we’re going to get Souters and Breyers, if we’re lucky. There will be NO …. NO…. chance of tax or regulatory cuts. McVain won’t have the stroke to push anything like that through, and he doesn’t even really care about or believe in those things either. Get ready for illegal alien amnesty to approach Mach 1. His “buddies” like Kennedy and Biden will routinely bend him over as they push a Democratic congress’ agenda. And … even though he may really want to be tough about the WOT … he’ll be hamstrung at every turn by the Dems. The ONLY reason W has had any measure of success in prosecuting the WOT is that, for the most part, he hasn’t given a shit what the press or Dems say. Attention-whore McVain will not suffer the same fate. He’ll do whatever his Dem/MSM masters suggest that he do so that he can be showered with their false praise.
And then …
After the 4 miserable years come to an end, guess what? We end up with Obama, Hillary or someone like them anyway. The MSM will villify and disparage the REPUBLICAN administration, even though it pursues a largely democrat agenda. REPUBLICANS will be blamed for all the ills that America faces - setting up a Dem candidate to come in and save the day. The 2012 election will see the old fart, if he’s even still alive, swept out of office in a landslide (a la Carter). The net result??? Instead of being fucked for 4 years, we get fucked for 8-12 years.
Oh yeah … the big lie behind the Obama/Hillary boogeyman … the one about a Democrat president bending over and taking it up the ass in the WOT. We would definitely lose ground under a democrat administration, but the simple fact of the matter is that they’re not going to give away the store any more than McVain would. Even Obama would be motivated by wanting to be re-elected (not by patriotism) to take at least nominal efforts to combat terrorism. There’s no way a president could afford to pull back in the WOT and have it result in another 9/11. Hillary knows this, and so does Curious Obama.
So … I ask all of those “lesser of two evils” voters … what do you see as the outcome of a McCain presidency???
May 13th, 2008 at 10:40 AMUsing
Misha,
I’ve asked you this before - but you keep not-answering the question:
How do you envision an Obama Presidency?
That’s not “How would you like to hyperbolically describe your reaction to an Obama Presidency?”
That’s not “Please say something flowery about ’standing-on-a-wall’ or ‘dying-on-a-hill’.”
That’s not “Make broad comparisons between the US & Europe, which has LONG since prostituted its collective ass for the chance to go on-the-dole.”
We have what is, arguably, the most radicalized, screamingly-liberal congress in history, and you’re talking about handing them a president that is inarguably to the far-Left of them, because McCain is a POS asshole.
Fine - your call.
I want to know how you envision an Obama Presidency - descibe what you imagine some of the most prominent features would be.
I just want to know that you’ve thought that part through.
- MuscleDaddy
May 13th, 2008 at 11:27 AMUsing
> He’s got your vote. That’s all that you have that he needs from you.
Very, very true. Or as is said in these parts, “The only two things a politician cares about is getting elected, and getting re-elected.”
The best thing I figure one can do in this situation is look at ALL the offices/seats coming up for election, the candidates for same, and if you happen to agree with the mindset and track record of any of these folks, give them a vote on that section of the ballot. Other seats that have no candidates that you feel are worthy, leave blank or do a write-in with a name you think WOULD do well (perhaps one of the presidential candidates that bowed out of the primaries earlier that you wish hadn’t?)
I’d love a write-in option… they don’t do those up here. Try to do that and it becomes a spoiled ballot.
I’d also love a recall option to force a by-election, but that’s in the “dreaming” category.
I’m Canadian, and am back in Canada living and working here in the Province of Ontario (God help me). I lived and worked in Kansas City Missouri for 7 years (from ‘95 to ‘02). American Politics has always been in my blood, those seven years just re-enforced that. When I was much younger (and stupider) I bought into the socialists lies. I’m much better now.
(Just breaks my heart to see the Republican Party drinking the kool-aid of the Democrats so much.)
May 13th, 2008 at 11:32 AMUsing
Not in specifics, that’s true, because I don’t have a crystal ball, and neither do you. But in general terms? Sure:
1) The war: He’ll talk a good game, but he’ll soon realize that if he wants a snowball’s chance in Hell of getting re-elected, which is all that ANY President really cares about, he’ll have to limit himself to empty gestures. He’s not going to aim to be “The President that Threw Our Gains Away and Brought the War Back to the U.S.” He knows this. He knows full well, no matter what he’s saying to the Kostards to keep their bong money rolling into his account, that the main reason that we haven’t gone the way of Bali, Madrid or London since 9/11 is that the terrorists are too busy dodging bullets in Assfuckistan. Oh, he’ll talk about troop drawdowns, he’ll babble about diplomacy, he might even try to engage in some (and end up with egg on his face), but he’s not going to wave a magic wand and declare the war over. Besides, he couldn’t if he wanted to.
2) The economy: Not doing too good as it is, and we can certainly say bye-bye to making the Bush cuts permanent. But they’re sunsetting in 2010 anyway, and if you for a second believe that McSuckup and a Republican minority are going to change that, then I have a bridge in Brooklyn that I’ll give you a real good quote on. Idiot regulations? He’d be hard pressed to come up with anything more idiotic than what McSwine is proposing (50 cent/gallon tax hikes on gas, his “new” carbon credit boondoggle, putting the pharmaceutical industry out of business by making it impossible for them to make a profit etc.), but he’ll still have to push it through Congress. If we make damn sure to pull out all the stops when it comes to supporting CONSERVATIVE Congresscritters in November, then he’ll be as effective as the Democrats have been over the last two years. Remember those two years? The two years of the Most Ethical Congress Evah that were going to make all of these changes now that they controlled both the House and the Senate? If they were paid according to their accomplishments, they’d be selling pencils on street corners in order to afford their Ramen Noodles by now.
McSocialist would attempt all of this too, the only difference being that, with a GOP President, the GOP would be guaranteed NOT to fight it. They’re not about to risk their committee positions, their spot in the party hierarchy, their RNC handouts for re-election etc. etc. etc. by fighting “one of their own” and “splitting the party.” Their careers would be toast if they did and, directing your attention toward the post again, their careers are the ONLY things that they give a shit about. If you think they’ll risk years of kissing babies and asses to make you happy, you’re deluding yourself.
3) Gun control: Ha! Like the Obamessiah is going to risk his nuts by pissing off 80 million gun owners and, more importantly, VOTERS. Gun control is the Third Rail in politics in this country, and every politician in DC knows this. By all means talk a good game, but be careful not to actually touch that rail, because you’ll be out on your ear so quick you don’t know what hit you.
4) Illegal immigration: What could the Obamessiah possibly suggest that would be worse than what McLaRaza endorses? Promising to personally give blowjobs to every illegal immigrant crossing the border prior to handing out their new citizenship certificates? Really now. Tell me, because I can’t think of anything.
5) Judicial nominees: He’ll suggest candidates that will get the backing of the Democrats, just as McSwine will do. If he nominates anybody to the left of who Mc”Alito is too conservative”Cain would nominate, they’ll be filibustered. Chances are they might be even if they are the exact same candidates. Again because the GOP part of the Senate will fight Obamadingdong but NOT McRINO. At worst, looking at the actual list of possible retirees, we’ll get 1 to 3 liberal justices replaced with, *GASP!*, liberal justices.
I think that about covers it.
The key to THIS election year is the House and the Senate, not the White House. We’ll be fucked no matter which one of Larry, Curly or Moe gets the post, the only difference being that we’ll be guaranteed to be fucked again in 2012 if we let McCain fuck up the nation in the name of the GOP.
May 13th, 2008 at 11:58 AMUsing
Last try.
“BOILING FROG”
look it up if you need to
dead frog = total American Socialism/Communism
May 13th, 2008 at 12:46 PMboiling water = voting for Clinton or Obama
gradually heating water = voting for McCain
Using
Eyas,
Didn’t ask you for a try - or for a record-skip meme - or for some lame-assed attempt at trying to talk to me as though I were unintelligent.
(you’ve not been paying attention, if you actually believe that)
=============================================
We’ve got here the same debate that’s happening all over talk radio right now:
Mark Levin says that he cannot, in good conscience, vote for McCain given the idealogical differences between the two (that’s fair).
Hugh Hewitt said “America can survive a lot - but I’m not sure it could survive the hole that Obama could dig it into in four years.”
You want a wake-up call for the conservative base?
I think they’ve got it right now.
I don’t think they’ll let this happen again…. if we can make it through the next 4 with anything intact.
- MuscleDaddy
May 13th, 2008 at 1:13 PMUsing
Misha:
If politicians are all so corrupt, then why were you backing Fred? He must have been pretty vain to want to be President, and, according to you definition of politicians, he has no morals.
With your argument, I guess we should all stop voting. Period. What difference does it make when the politicians are all in it for themselves? Why not move to a dictatorship since we’re obviously so useless as voters?
Throwing one’s hands in the air and giving up is what they did in Europe. And look where that got them.
And frankly, your logic about what Obamassiah will do in office is silly. I believe you have underestimated him by miles. I’ve been reading about his activist background recently, and with a liberal congress and senate behind him, little commie Obammi will do a LOT of damage to our country.
Misha, I usually laugh at your cynicism, but I’m not laughing anymore.
May 13th, 2008 at 1:16 PMUsing
You think the Dems would play-nice with a filibuster, the way the GOP did?
I firmly believe that, with the current congress behind him, Obama could make “at worst” much, much worse.
The current 1-to-3 may be Liberal fools, but I have faith in Obama’s ability to come up with something you would barely be able to tell from real evil.
- MuscleDaddy
May 13th, 2008 at 1:19 PMUsing
Well put, Misha. I’d rather see Obama and the Democrat Party taking the hits for their inevitable policy fuck-ups than Conservatives for the fuck-ups of a Liberal Democrat with an “R” after his name. Voting for McBrainless or the other two anencephalics is a complete waste of the half dozen calories it will take to mark a ballot.
I say “Vote Fudd/Sam” and let others play in poo by putting Yobama in the Antiwhiteyhouse. We conservatives will nail his balls to the floor with a conservative Congress and aggressive phone/email/snailmail/protest campaigns to make sure those assholes remember who the fuck butters their bread.
Elmer Fudd/Yosemite Sam ‘08
May 13th, 2008 at 1:22 PMUsing
I invite you to look at the film of Farrakhan’s sweating, yelling, paranoid face and to bear in mind that this depraved thug, who boasts of “dealing with” one of black America’s moral heroes, is the man praised by Jeremiah Wright and referred to with respect as “Minister Farrakhan” by Senator Obama who hopes to be the next president of the United States.
http://www.slate.com/id/2190589/
May 13th, 2008 at 1:29 PMUsing
Hell, as long as you’re on this crusade to vote for McCain, I’d talk to you as if you’re an idiot. Because you are.
In answer to your endless whining about the nature of an Obama regime? Not much worse than a McCain regime for the nation - and far less damaging to both conservatives and to the GOP.
May 13th, 2008 at 1:31 PMUsing
[...] Why John McCain shouldn’t get your conservative vote. [...]
May 13th, 2008 at 1:39 PMUsing
Scary Signals: Obama’s Ideology Hints At Dangerous Policy
http://www.americant.....ology.html
May 13th, 2008 at 1:41 PMUsing
The dire events on Lebanon have given us an opportunity to discover Senator Barack Obama’s worldview and how it might influence his policies towards the conflict between Israel and the Palestinians.
http://www.americant.....n_and.html
May 13th, 2008 at 1:46 PMUsing
The pro-McCain advocates in Misha’s threads have the reek of troll. No offense to people who genuinely are ok with McCain’s policies (whoever that is), but many of the “arguments” with diehard, locked-in McCain voters seem to start at
…and then go from there.
Let me break it down for you:
1) There is no reason to prefer Obama over McCain. Both are liable to land in the same spot on the liberal/conservative axis. McCain will compromise to his liberal pals in congress, Obama will compromise to conservatives to get elected (his electoral map includes too many red states for him not to).
2) Justices? Sure, why not. Point for McCain. But the court is split 4.5-4.5 now. Republicans will be in comfortable filibustering range, now that the Dems have so kindly established the precedent of the judicial filibuster, and we probably won’t even have to because most new Congressional dems are blue-dogs.
3) Immigration? McCain just the other day confirmed that his “secure the borders first” spiel has been a load of crap. How much worse could Obama be? Unless he reassigns the Border Patrol to recruit new immigrants from Mexico itself, he can’t be.
4) The War? Another tossup. McCain would finish the war; Obama promises to withdraw troops…18 months after he’s inaugurated. Furthermore, the Democrats will stop whining and obstructing once it’s their war, just as they did for Bubba. Just look at how quickly they turned on Mother Sheehan when she dared to run against San Fran Nan.
5) There’s no way Republicans are going to start making up a lick of ground while they remain the party in power. Heck, after two years of McCain, Loyal Citizens could end up having to vote for Democratic candidates running to McCain’s right.
I intend to vote for McCain because there are a handful of issues where a nominal conservative would be better for the country. But I’m sure I could think of less-important issues where having a nutroots-approved do-gooder muck out the stable (Internet and IP issues, technology initiatives, eminent domain, etc) would be nice, as well. Face it, if McCain is the better candidate for Republicans, it’s by such a tiny margin that you can’t expect to convert everyone who have good reason to dislike him personally.
May 13th, 2008 at 2:32 PMUsing
Bill Less-than-Quick,
Clearly, you are short-sighted, lack imagination and are unable to stop listening to your own internal echo-chamber long enough to pay attention.
Fortunately, these are all shortcomings for which you may compensate, if you commit to try hard enough.(unlike your others).
I am not on a “crusade to vote for McCain” - I have been seeking clarification on the matter of people thinking through a longer-view of their (entirely fair) decision to “Never-Vote-For-McCain-Because-He’s-A-Piece-Of-Shit”.
People will vote (or not) for whomever they want - my desire is to be sure that the people whose opinions I respect and care about (Note: I had not addressed you) have thought their decision all-the-way-through.
My position has been (and remains):
“No matter how bad you think it could get, it can likely get worse and you want to be sure you’re considering that.”
That having been said, you may now take your socialist-self (for who else would try to reduce very real and easily-substantiated concerns about Obama to “endless whining”) and begone - you bore me.
- MuscleDaddy
May 13th, 2008 at 2:32 PMUsing
Nerbygirl-
Why be so obtuse about it? It’s not like we’ve tried skatey-eight times before to convince folks, that we’re not advocating NOT VOTING in any way, shape or form, that’s your choice and I’ll fight to protect it. In fact the point of the post and our conversation was that we’re not using our vote wisely. We can’t keep walking into the booth and pulling the lever hoping to prevent, what will invariably happen again with the current paradigm, that if we don’t “it will be worse”.
We despair that something so elementally simple, just doesn’t get through to otherwise smart people.
The point IS recognizing that you don’t have to vote for more shit sammiches, but can withhold voting, as a vote in and of itself. Continuing to vote for Shit Sandwich (A) because Shit Sandwich (B) has more shit, will invariably lead to (C) and (D) Turds-On-A-Bun. The only way to correct the dog shitting on your carpet is to correct it immediately (or shoot it), not just cover the carpet with more paper. What is so fucking complicated about the idea that for once we choose NONE of the below and will continue to do so until you give us an acceptable candidate? Sooner or later the message will be received, once they learn “We The People” will consistently and categorically reject their latest incarnation of what THEY want us to put into office. By default the other side wins and they lose in each case. Remember they want to stay in office at any costs, so it’s the “Will of the People” or “Do you want to super-size that order?”.
We find ourselves in 2008 in the precise predicament that voting for (A) as the lesser of two evils, really isn’t. We can come up with “oh, but B or C would be worse” scenarios all day long and still not address the problem by reinforcing the system that gave us “Feces On White, Wheat or Rye?” There are plenty of good candidates on the ballot at the local, federal and state levels that desperately need our support, by all means do your solemn duty as an American and VOTE, but don’t do it holding your nose, thinking that you know why it’s necessary (that’s the exact programming they want you to have) and you would be wrong.
The Executive branch still has checks and balances from the Legislative and the Judicial. We need to trust the people to rise up and resist by whatever means any truly vile direction the WH pushes us towards.
May 13th, 2008 at 2:33 PMUsing
Muscle Daddy.. I agree with you 100% on Less than Quick. Its funny that a guy who has a picture of the WTC burning on his blogpage can not understand that on the MOST IMPORTANT issue,TERRORISM, there is a world of difference between McCain and Obammy. All other issues pale in importance to TERRORISM. Those who cant see that invite more 9-11s
May 13th, 2008 at 3:12 PMUsing
Palestinians in Gaza Are Phonebanking for Barack Obama
Palestinians in Gaza Are Phonebanking for Barack Obama
Palestinians in Gaza Are Phonebanking for Barack Obama
http://campaignspot......I1ZDA5M2Q=
May 13th, 2008 at 3:18 PMUsing
Is it too late to swap D[INO] LIeberman for R[INO] McCain? I suppose…
McC`s only position remaining that makes a difference to me is 2nd Amendment. But considering his attitude toward the 1st, I am not actually of his stance. And considering that as Prexy his only real option in opposing a gun-grab/ban would be a highly unlikely veto, why bother?
But in those places where House (and Senate?) seats just might go (R) please vote. And watch more local options - your Governor or even local State Representative may go all the way someday!
Not saying vote for the (D) Presidential nominee, necessarily: I don’t intend to. Every year protest votes for the likes of Donald Duck show up.
May 13th, 2008 at 3:20 PMUsing
hitnrun,
I like your argument. I really hope you’re right. One of my colleagues tends to think the same way you do.
May 13th, 2008 at 3:30 PMUsing
Hoghead,
The only “advantage” (for lack of a better word) of a Clinton or Obama presidency is that if there WERE another 9/11, they would be history.
May 13th, 2008 at 3:31 PMUsing
Since the next 9-11 will likely be of the dirty nuke variety, Im not sure that would be much consolation to the 100,000+ victims. And the MSM would immediately cover for Osamma, probably by trying to pin the blame on Bush. Its not a risk Im willing to take, and it is the ONLY reason I will vote for McCain.
(BTW Actually, I think Clinton would be far superior to Obama in the terror arena)
May 13th, 2008 at 3:48 PMUsing
For those who bleat that theres no difference between Osamma, Hitlerly or McCain, maybe the ratings by the American CONSERVATIVE Union will be a thought starter.
ACU Ratings for the Likely 2008 Presidential Candidates
Republicans
Name Lifetime Rating 2005 Rating
Representative Tom Tancredo (CO) 99 100
Senator Sam Brownback (KS) 95 100
Senator George Allen (VA) 92 100
Representative Duncan Hunter (CA) 92 92
Former Speaker Newt Gingrich (GA) 90 N/A
Senator Chuck Hagel (NE) 86 96
Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist (TN) 89 92
Senator John McCain (AZ) 83 80
Democrats
Name Lifetime Rating / 2005 Rating
Senator Evan Bayh (IN) 21 20
Senator Joseph Biden (DE) 14 8
Former Senate Majority Leader Tom Daschle (SD) 13 N/A
Senator Russ Feingold (WI) 12 13
Former Senator John Edwards (NC) 10 N/A
Senator Hillary Clinton (NY) 9 12
Former Vice President Al Gore (TN) 9 N/A
Senator Barack Obama (IL) 8 8
Senator John Kerry (MA) 5 8
——————————————————————————————————————–
Oh yeah theyre ALL THE SAME.
The American Conservative Union is the nation’s oldest and largest grassroots conservative lobbying organization. ACU’s purpose is to communicate and advance the goals and principles of conservatism through one multi-issue, umbrella organization. ACU’s Statement of Principles expresses our commitment to a market economy, the doctrine of original intent of the framers of the Constitution, traditional moral values, and a strong national defense.
Since 1964, ACU has been on the cutting edge of major public policy battles. Our most significant efforts, past and present, include fighting to keep OSHA off the backs of small businesses; opposing the Panama Canal giveaway; challenging the SALT treaties; supporting aid to freedom fighters in communist countries; promoting the confirmation of conservative justices to the Supreme Court; advocating near-term deployment of strategic defenses; and battling against higher taxes and wasteful government spending.
Additionally, in 1994, through its Citizens against Rationing Health coalition, sponsorship of national town meetings, and Health Care Truth Tour, ACU spearheaded the conservative response to the Clintons’ health-care proposals.
Whether fighting for lower taxes and less government spending, supporting more effective and efficient military protection, or defending the cause of freedom worldwide, the American Conservative Union seeks to promote the national conservative movement and to be the conservative voice in Washington
May 13th, 2008 at 4:00 PM————————————————————————————————————————————-
Using
Fred might actually have had morals, Nerby. It could have been the reason that he never really got “into” the whole being a politician thing and why he dropped out so quickly. Who knows?
The thing is, you’re missing the point. I don’t care if Fred or anybody else have morals. They’re politicians, so it’s safe to assume that they don’t. I don’t want to make the category error of treating them as something they’re not, so I go with something that I know that they ARE: People with a whole lot of time invested in getting a job as politicians, a job that they, considering the time and treasure they’ve put into it, are quite certain to want to keep at all costs. Priority number one. In order to understand your enemy, you must first know what makes him tick. Once you know what makes him tick, you will then be able to manipulate him or, at the very least, predict his actions so that you may take the necessary precautions.
I say again: Politicians are not your “friends”, they don’t care about you outside of getting your vote. Other than that, you’re nothing to them, you have nothing to offer them other than your vote so, once that has been secured, why on EARTH should they do something they don’t want to do and get nothing in return? To please you? Not hardly. Or unless you have access to a sizable bank account in the Caymans and are willing to bribe, er, “contribute to his campaign.”
Quid pro quo. It’s what makes the world go around, and once you’ve understood that principle, there’s pretty much nothing in the world that you can’t explain or predict, unless you don’t have all of the facts.
The politician’s “quo” is whatever policy you want him to support. Your “quid” is your vote. Period. Once you’ve handed over your “quid”, he has absolutely NO incentive to deliver your “quo” unless it happens to be what he’d do anyway.
It really is that simple. He isn’t in politics to make tears of grateful joy stream down your face. He’s in politics to STAY in politics.
That doesn’t mean that we shouldn’t vote, however. I don’t know where you got that idea. It means precisely the opposite. Given that the only way we can influence a politician is with our votes because it is the ONLY thing that he’s interested in, we certainly should vote. IF, and only IF he is going to do what we want him to. And we should make it abundantly, crystal clear to him that if he DOESN’T, then the vote goes bye-bye and he can start preparing for a job in the fast food industry. It’s the only motivator that we the people have, short of a bloody revolution, and I think that most of us would agree that that’s not an ideal solution, to say the very least.
But you have to keep in mind that once you cast that vote for him, you’ve said “I’m OK with what you’re doing, carry on.”
That is the only message you’re getting across. Sure, you may think that you’re really saying “I bloody hate what you’re doing, but since the alternative is worse, I’ll vote for you anyway. Just don’t keep doing what you’re doing or else.” For all that I know, that might be exactly what you’re thinking in the voting booth, but it doesn’t matter.
What’s the difference between the two statements up there? NOTHING. He still has your vote, the only thing that you have that he gives a fuck about. You can think, write, scream, yell and stomp all you want outside of that, but it doesn’t matter. He still has your vote and absolutely NO incentive to do anything other than what he’s been doing all along. And not only that, you’ve also just told him that yep, that “look at the much scarier bastard over there” tactic works like a charm with you, so expect to see more of it in the future. Do you think he’s going to give up something that works?
And trust me, there will always be “something scarier over there.” Once a politician rolls that one out, you know it’s because he has absolutely nothing to offer that you want, because if he DID, he’d use that instead.
So he has your vote now, and he’ll go on doing exactly what he has been doing, just as junior will continue emptying the cookie jar once you let him off the hook. Why shouldn’t he? You just gave it your 100% stamp of approval, after all, since the vote IS your 100%. You can’t anymore “vote a little bit” for somebody than you can be “a little bit pregnant.” They’re both binary concepts. Either you do, or you don’t. Either you are, or you aren’t.
So yes, we absolutely SHOULD vote. But sometimes we ought to give some thought to NOT voting as well.
Politicians’ manifest lack of morals and utter egotism isn’t a reason not to vote, anymore than the egotism of a private business is a reason not to buy their product. Just make sure that you know what you’re buying before you put money on the table, and be really really sure that you’re not going to regret the purchase. Immoral and egotistical people aren’t hard to deal with, they’re actually very easy to deal with since their every action is so much more predictable.
Just don’t make the error of assuming that politicians are in some way different from the rest of humanity and answer to “a higher calling” of some sort. They don’t. They are utterly self-interested just like the rest of humanity, and pretending that they give a flip about anything other than keeping what they have and getting more of it is as silly and basic an error of logic as when somebody starts assigning human characteristics to his pet rock.
May 13th, 2008 at 4:03 PMUsing
McCains ACU rating is even higher than Uber-Conservative Ron Paul
May 13th, 2008 at 4:04 PMUsing
Which ought to tell you just exactly how useful the ACU’s “rating” is in evaluating somebody’s conservative bona fides.
Not to mention that there’s a distinct difference between McVain’s lifetime rating and his rating since, say, 2000 when those mean conservatives snatched his brass ring away and made the whiny little pissant throw strained peas all over his high chair.
Oddly enough, only one of those two ratings is ever talked about. I wonder why that could be?
But by all means, keep doing it, I don’t care. I know a bit about statistics and how they’re gathered, and I know what I’m seeing with my own eyes. Now what should I believe? A number arrived at by some method of counting votes or my own lying eyes?
Tough call.
May 13th, 2008 at 4:18 PMUsing
What the fuck votes is the ACU using for their ratings? It seems they aren’t looking at votes such as campaign finance reform, immigration reform, tax cuts, environmental issues, judicial nominations, etc. all of which there is no difference between McCain, Clinton, and Obama.
Hoghead and Muscledaddy, Misha answered you about what he forsaw an Obama presidency to be like, now how about you answer Big Dogg’s question in #3 about what you forsee in a McCain presidency.
May 13th, 2008 at 4:27 PMUsing
McCains Lifetime 83.5
2006 80
May 13th, 2008 at 4:35 PMUsing
That’s the 2007 rating, unless the ACU don’t know their own numbers. Funny, by the way, how his “conservative” rating can be 80 in the year of the Great Shamnesty Debacle, isn’t it? You know, McCain/Kennedy?
But, for the sake of completeness, and you may verify with the ACU since that’s where I got the numbers from:
2001: 68
2002: 78
2003: 80
2004: 72
2005: 80
2006: 65
2007: 80
Now compare to Chuck Hagel, yes, that Chuck Hagel’s 86 and I think it’s pretty obvious what I’m trying to say here.
And before you say “but he still has a higher rating than Obama!”, I’ll save you the time by pointing out that he has a higher rating than Josef Stalin and Pol Pot too, but I’m not voting for any of those either.
May 13th, 2008 at 4:50 PMUsing
OK here goes. McCain wont touch Campaign Finance Reform or Social Security because he wont have enough votes to get any plan of his thru. On immigration, he will follow in GWBs footsteps, which basically is ignoring the problem.He will try to extend the Bush tax cuts because the economy he would inherit sucks, but the Dhimmi congress will defeat any cuts, and most likely pass tax INCREASES on anyone making over $60,000. On the Environment, he seems to be buying into the global warming scam, as has 90% of congress and 75% of the American people. Judicially, I think any nominee he sends up will be moderate compared to Obamas FAR LEFT choices. And obammy will support REPARATIONS, Mac wont.
So far, I havent proved my point. HOWEVER on the MOST IMPORTANT issue,TERRORISM, there is a world of difference between McCain and Obammy. All other issues pale in importance to TERRORISM. Those who cant see that invite more 9-11s. We would be sitting ducks with OB, and MAC would take on the terrorists and prevent another 9-11. Theres really no other issue or issues as important than safety from TERRORISM. Its LIFE and DEATH. CFR, taxes or immigration might piss you off but they WONT KILL YOU. TERRORISM WILL.
Why the hell do you think the Palestinians are phonebanking for obamma?? And that HAMAS endorsed OB??
May 13th, 2008 at 4:57 PMDo I like Mac. HELL NO. But I like him far more than the alternatives. And when/if osamma gets elected and Israel or an American city gets nuked, you guys who decided not to vote better not come in here blaming anybody but your selves.
Using
LC Jackboot:
I wasn’t being obtuse whatsoever. I was being pragmatic.
Don’t vote for McCain. I don’t care. Go ahead and vote for your local candidates. In my state, our brilliant citizens voted for a majority of Democrats to represent them. Let’s see how that’s worked out for the folks in Minnesota:
The local legislators just approved an increased gas tax, more useless mass transit(that nobody uses) and more of my tax money to be handed over to the Mall of America for “expansion”. My guess is that they’ll add even more “fees” before their session is over. In essence, I’m going to be f—ed by my “representatives” once again. Yippee!!!
You see, that’s what happens when you have liberal Democratic legislators. They’ve even over-ridden our Republican Governor’s veto!
Nationally, a liberal legislative branch, liberal executive branch, and possibly a liberal judicial branch will assure that the checks and balances go bye-bye. And if you don’t think that Obama will pass every piece of legislation that his liberal Congress puts on his desk, you are naive.
I just spent a week in Michigan, one of the most depressed States in our Union. They have one of the highest unemployment rates in the country. Also some of the highest foreclosure rates. Oh, and their taxes get increased every year. Why? The Democrats are in charge. And the Dems(and the Unions)run the State.
The poor residents are moving away in droves.
I don’t want the WHOLE country to become like Michigan. And if that means voting to make sure that we have ONE check in the balance, I’ll vote McCain. And saying that he is exactly the same as the other two piles of “poo” is an outright lie. You’re not the only one who has looked at McCain’s voting record. You just choose to look at the votes you don’t LIKE.
You want Obama as Commander in Chief over McCain? A guy who hasn’t been in office for two full years and has barely shown up to the Senate floor to DO his job? A guy who is so full of himself that he actually believes his own rhetoric? A guy who hangs out with America haters and terrorist bombers?
That’s okay with you?
Well it’s NOT okay with me.
If Obama becomes President, God help us all.
PS By the way, THIS woman has not been “programmed” to believe anything by anyone. You are a very smart man and I respect that. Please don’t insult my intelligence.
May 13th, 2008 at 4:57 PMUsing
PS…And I pray to GOD that you or your loved ones are NOT in that nuked city.
May 13th, 2008 at 5:00 PMUsing
I think he’s probably right about the McCain Presidency (I was a rabid Fred supporter too) - while it’s happening.
Where we differ is on the effect that will have afterward.
I think that McCain will show the country what a Conservative doesn’t look like - I think that the MSM’s attempts to paint the ensuing troubles as being “Republican” in nature will fall of deaf ears, as no-one will come to accept that McCain was ever a Republican - much less anyone’s idea of a Conservative.
I think the people will see that they’ve already had 4 years of a Dem White House and, come 2012, someone of a ‘Jindal-variety’ of conservative will step up and say “That’s enough, it’s time we took our country back.”
And I believe that what’s left to salvage will be more than the ‘nothing’ we would be left with after Obama.
- MuscleDaddy
May 13th, 2008 at 5:02 PMUsing
AMEN NERBY AMEN
May 13th, 2008 at 5:02 PMUsing
Misha:
Your postings are lagging on my computer. I just got yours.
Since I’m dealing directly with one of my Senators and Congressman at this time, I have no ill-conceived idea that they really “care” about me. I’m not that naive. But they DO want my vote, and my “press story” and all the rest, and that is what I’m trying to use to get them to work in my favor. I GET IT.
What I DON’T get is your utter disdain for “McVain”. And I DO fear the Left taking over this country. Read my post to Jackboot if you want to know why.
By the way, my pet rock is named Larry
May 13th, 2008 at 5:08 PMUsing
That nerby is one smart wahine !!
May 13th, 2008 at 5:10 PMUsing
Wouldn’t you all just love to know how many RINO-SNOBS are moving money out of this country, and plan to follow it even if Mcvane wins? Forget political survival. Think about survival.
May 13th, 2008 at 5:14 PMUsing
I suggest that any of you who do not believe Obama’s reign will affect YOUR life should go visit Michigan. I have never traveled through a state with more “ghost” towns in my life. I spoke at length with at least 50 different people in there, and I was utterly shocked and dismayed at the hardships they were enduring. Just drive through Lansing, Battle Creek, Grand Rapids, Detroit and see for yourself. And there is no end in sight for the residents of that State. They are now being taxed to death.
May 13th, 2008 at 5:22 PMThat’s what happens when liberals take over: DESTRUCTION FROM WITHIN.
Using
I hear you nerbygirl. Life here in CO is that only worse, we have Dems across the board. We’ve had a lovely year of tax raising and multiple attempts to dismantle the Tabor Ammendment, our attempt at controlling out of control spending by politicians. It says that the people HAVE to vote on tax increases, isn’t that terrible? And when you change something to make the tax/fee an effective increase, like a mill levie, that has to be voted on too.
For the next year, we have “kill the economy for global warming” and “suck money out of us for higher leftist ed” to look forward to.
And a bunch of the so-called Republicans went along with all of it in the name of ‘bipartisanship’.
It will be interesting to see what happens in the next election. Will people be sick of being taxed to death and vote conservative?
A big part of the problem was that the Repubs put up horrible, weak candidates. You just knew that people in the center wouldn’t vote for them.
My parents are enamored with McCain and are always trying to convince me about how great he is. I think it’s just because he’s their generation and they’re thinking more about the Vietnam war years than current issues.
All in all, it’s just a depressing year.
May 13th, 2008 at 5:25 PMUsing
LC HOGHEAD sez:
pretty well sums up why I’m voting for him too, that and the troops we have in harms way deserve a better CinC than hitlery or obamamama. McCain’s not a choice I make personally but I feel that I have to vote with others in mind this time around…..there’s too much at stake right now.
May 13th, 2008 at 5:56 PMUsing
Rainy:
I have cousins who live in Colorado Springs and Loveland, and they say the same thing. Their beautiful state is turning into the land of “tax-and-spend tree huggers”. And I can relate to your lack of good Republican candidates. We have several who caved in to the demands of the Left, hence our governor’s veto override.
If my taxes go up anymore, I may be forced to move–if I can even GET anyone to buy my house.
If we give the liberals total control of this Country, it’s only going to get worse….
May 13th, 2008 at 5:59 PMUsing
Misha and several others in this thread have given you the long view.
1. Send a message with your vote that you will no longer stand for a liberal in the WH. If we had done this in 1996 we wouldn’t be dealing with McCain now. Voting for McCain sends the opposite message of what needs to be sent and is only of short-term usefulness (if you even accept that McCain will be a better choice than Obama - which is debatable - in the first place).
2. Vote to protect the conservative movement. This means refraining from voting for McCain. Clearly, from any long-term strategic viewpoint, a vote for McCain is a vote to destroy conservatism.
3. Vote to put the least qualified liberal ever to get the Dem nomination in the WH to show the nation how truly insipid and awful liberalism can be. A weak, naive, easily rolled liberal in the WH will be inestimably easier for a GOP minority to fight than having a liberal McCain in the WH promoting global warming and amnesty bills (which the GOP will not fight)
On this last point, McCain has been making high profile public speeches of late about his support of “comprehensive immigration reform” and “Cap ‘n’ Trade”. This proves one of two things:
a. He hates conservatives and does not want them to vote for him since these two issues are HUGE red flags for us.
b. He is dumb as a box of hair and has no idea that global warming is a hoax and the science doesn’t support it.
Bottom line, McCain is a danger to himself and this nation. He should be soundly defeated for a host of reasons. Being too stupid to run for president is only one of those reasons.
May 13th, 2008 at 6:07 PMUsing
Rainy, Nerby:
I was born and raised in Colorado, my mom and sister still live there. My father passed away about three years ago and we have been trying to hide his estate from those same taxers and spenders ever since. One part of the estate was a piece of property he willed to my sister and me up on Kenosha Pass (I have property in South Park!!) It’s a piece of property he was trying to sell and we’re trying as well. There’s not a real estate agent who will touch it or list it because a small creek runs through it and the greenies have designated 2/3 of the property as a “protected wetland”…..we can do nothing with it except continue to pay the $800 property tax on it every year.
It will be interesting to see what happens in Denver this summer when the surrendercrat convention comes to town…..I’ve already extended an invitation to my Mom and Sister to come spend that week up here in Wa. State with my wife and me.
May 13th, 2008 at 6:11 PMUsing
There always will be, my friend, there always will be…
That’s how it works. Wouldn’t be much of a strategy if it didn’t.
May 13th, 2008 at 6:21 PMUsing
LC MuscleDaddy
I’m assuming that by “unlike your others” you mean folks like me. You know, Conservatives who are fed up with the shit-for-brains Republican Party that elevated a damned leftist backstabber to represent us… and don’t see one fucking iota of a nano-difference between him and the two dhimwits from the dildocrat party. Actually there is one difference: a McCain Presidency will insure there won’t be another Conservative in the White House for 20 years.
I refuse to use my vote to support a political candidate that sneers at my conservative principles and signs onto every leftist cause and Pseudoscientific Chicken Little Bullshit™. He is not the lesser of three evils, he is at least the equal of three evils. In other words, after careful evaluation of each candidate, I find them all equally dangerous to this country. Rather than “hold my nose” and reinforce the Republican Party’s aberrant leftist swing, I choose to use my precious vote, small as it is, and make a statement to those who shepherd the party. You might consider this unthinking and perhaps even unpatriotic. Fine. I consider it quite the opposite. Elections are supposed to be about choice and I have been robbed of that. This country is fast becoming a one-party operation and we had better do something fast to stop it. I feel it is my duty to use my vote in a way that will not reward this un-American trend. I suggest you drop the role of insuring the thoroughness of thinking things “all-the-way-through” police. We don’t need your help. Rotties are decidedly NOT mindless automatrons. If they choose a course of action, you can bet they’ve thought it through.
Whether or not McCain loses to one or the other of his clones, I’ll wager that all it will take to spark a second American Revolution is a couple of tyrannical Executive Orders from whatever leftist Asshat-in-Chief that manages to slither into the Oval Office. Ask your nearest southern gun-owning, overtaxed, under-appreciated, hard-working citizen. He/she is awfully tense right now.
May 13th, 2008 at 6:22 PMUsing
Jaybear:
A creek is being designated as “wetland”? What next? An ocean is going to be designated as a lake?
Why don’t you try to crash the convention? It would be entertaining to watch a bunch of wacky liberals salivating all over themselves. And then killing each other when Hillary steals the nomination.
May 13th, 2008 at 6:25 PMI can hope can’t I?
Using
nerby
only when it rains and it spills over it’s banks….but that’s enough….after all, it’s land and it’s wet right? and that’s how liberal logic works.
May 13th, 2008 at 6:30 PMUsing
The whole “wetlands” thing came home to roost in Atlanta this last year when the Army Corps of Engineers took orders from the Feds to drain the primary recreational lake in the Atlanta area in order to keep some stupid mussel in Florida wet.
Thousands of local businesses that relied on the lake’s water failed as a result of this idiotic bowing down to the Endangered Species Act. Thousands more home owners around the lake suddenly found their home’s value dropping precipitously as they learned they were no longer actually on the lake. Marina’s started going belly up, restaurants around the lake had no customers (or even a way for customers to get to their docks), landscapers couldn’t sell landscaping because no watering was allowed, and on and on.
Liberals should be taken out and shot (metaphorically of course :em12: )
May 13th, 2008 at 6:41 PMUsing
LC Beeblebrox:
But don’t you underSTAND? Mussels are MUCH more important than humans. They’re so much tastier!
May 13th, 2008 at 6:59 PMUsing
Nerby, I’m curious as to how you know this for sure. :em93:
May 13th, 2008 at 7:05 PMUsing
yep, I fish up there and know a few of those farmers. Funny thing, if it HAS rained and gotten the ground mucky and there’s standing water I can’t even walk over it in some places…..’cuz it’s now a wetland and I might disturb it with my big evil wader boots.
May 13th, 2008 at 7:08 PMUsing
LC Beeblebrox and the rest of the LC’s present
Herein is the problem with your take on matters.
Agreed McCain (or McPain as we call hime here) is as liberal as they come in most areas that affect our wallets, but he at least (so far) is not going to sleep with the Donks 100% of the time.
True to form, that is to say if any RINO is in the WH, they will stay true to form and attack McPain for the next 4 years no matter what he does as they have no other playbook. I think McPain may have enough of the “FU” spirit left in him to not roll over every time he is attacked and I want to see whom the VP slot is filled with in case he croaks.
O’Bambi on the other hand is a political doormat for the entire Donk cabal and will do exactly what Teddy Schwimmer, Nancy Pelousy and Harry Corruption Reid want done, in spades, as O’Bambi is a dyed in the wool Marxist straight from the bloody kremilin by way of Kenya, an ultra liberal mother and that my friends is truly something to fear.
What are the choices? Think that Ron Paulbots manage to pull an upset? Or that McPain will go apoplectic and drop dead? Not vote come November? Vote for O’Bambi? Hope the RNC has the balls to put forth an un-heard of candidate at the convention?
Not likely. Heck I was thinking Thompson to be the best of the bunch in the conservative electable category and that went nowhere.
After looking at this from all angles, it simply leads back to “take what you can get” of the lesser evil.
That is it folks, live with 4 years of McPain and use the time wisely to change the course and message back to true conservative values, tax reductions twinned with government slimming (start with kiling a few agencies - education, energy, osha, HUD, DNR etc.), put originalists on the bench, vote in fresh blood wherever possible.
Oh yeah, the war is still on guys and it needs to spread to Iran before things will get better.
BTW, I am an import as are many others in this group. I hail from a small S. American country. Two years in the U.S. Navy then sacrifice and study to make this my country (legally!). I have taken nothing from the government that was not earned and prefer them to stay out of my bloody way so I can keep building a future for my family (all U.S. citizens by birth exept for yours truly) by way of god given talents and personal effort.
Enough!
May 13th, 2008 at 7:14 PMUsing
DJ wrote:
No, actually only your statement was stupid.
Only an unborn baby can be “aborted” and unless you believe that babies are able to determine their ideology before they are born, then it is IMPOSSIBLE to abort a conservative.
Meanwhile, I can shoot a liberal at any point along the way.
As for the lake, Lanier is an “impounded” section of the Chattahoochie river north of Atlanta. The lake was created in 1957 both as a source of water for Atlanta and a recreational area. This predates the ESA so it was never intended to keep mussels wet regardless of where on the food chain they are.
We had very little rain this last year but the Feds wanted to keep the mussels wet as if it was a wet year. If it were not for the artificially created Lake Lanier, the mussels would have experienced very little wetness and would have naturally died off. So essentially, the Feds were keeping the mussels artificially wet in defiance of nature, because there was a huge man made lake available for them to exploit to the benefit of the idiotic mussel.
The lake was never intended to keep lower Florida wet in times of drought but yet, that is what it was used for this last year to the detriment of everyone in the Atlanta area.
May 13th, 2008 at 7:18 PMUsing
Deej:
Yay, you’re back! The point of all of these comments are this DJ: People are losing their livelihoods because of EXTREME environmental decisions. When do we put humans first?
Are we willing to destroy the lives of our citizens to save a mussel? Come on. There has to be some sensibility involved in all of this. That’s all I’m asking for.
I mean, I never thought they should kill the spotted owl. Why kill it? You can’t make it into a coat or anything….:)
And Beeblebrox: I’m just assuming that mussels taste better. Although I feel like I am being eaten alive by the taxes imposed by our government. THEY are the cannibals, as far as I’m concerned….
May 13th, 2008 at 7:19 PMUsing
Terrapod:
May 13th, 2008 at 7:26 PMYou are the bomb. Well said, from someone who had to EARN their citizenship. Just like my husband.
Using
MuscleDaddy:
If it’s fair for Dr. Levin, then why, prithee, would the same not be fair for the rest of us?
If we can avoid losing more than tree seats in the Senate, we can.
McCain-Feingold was a TEMPER TANTRUM done as payback for the 2000 South Carolina primary. Just to screw the people who denied this POS his “due”. The Gang of 14 was whoring himself for positive media coverage.
As a matter of fact, that has been his guiding “principal” since about 1990.
At some point, you have to say to yourself “If I vote for the lesser of two evils, I’m voting for EVIL.”
I’m sorry. Been there, done that, outgrew the t-shirt. The Republican Party has, except for one 8 year period, been a collection of northeast liberals attempting to be slightly less liberal than the “loyal” opposition since 1968. This nat be our last chance to get their attention.
The Republican party can either come back to me, or fuck ‘em. I’m not gonna hold my ankles for them.
I will sooner vote for Ralph Nader than John McCain. At least he is honest about being a moonbat.
In the end, Obama can do, at WORST 8 years of damage, provided he is re-elected.
McCain can kill the MOVEMENT for the next 40 years. I’ve been working too damn long (hint - I worked the Goldwater campaign) to allow that to happen. Fuck that, and the horse it rode in on.
May 13th, 2008 at 7:29 PMUsing
Oh, and by the way, a LOT of our problem in Atlanta once they started draining the lake is that we are over-run here with illegals. The cheap construction labor allowed for ridiculous, out-of-control residential building which depressed home sales to such an extent that home values started to go down. Adding insult to injury, the huge number of illegals also is a drain on local resources.
Traffic here is insane and I am no longer surprised when I hear that some major pile-up on a freeway killing women and children. was caused by a person of Hispanic persuasion with no driver’s license driving some old 1990 Astro Van.
We are exploiting illegal Mexican labor to build housing that developers can’t sell. They are bankrupting our schools and hospitals, drinking water that is not theirs, killing people on the freeways, taking up space in our prisons, stealing jobs away from Americans, and demanding that we print all our government documents and signage in Spanish.
I have to ask you Terrapod, when was the last time Obama sponsored legislation that could do all that?
May 13th, 2008 at 7:29 PMUsing
So you think Bob Dole was a conservative ?? Many stayed home then too and look what we got. Four more years of Clinton. Great strategery !!!!
May 13th, 2008 at 7:39 PMUsing
This is a bit unfair to the Thompson campaign. In fact, surprisingly, given his laid-back approach to the primaries, Thompson did very well over all. Had the primaries started in Georgia or South Carolina, Thompson would probably be our nominee right now.
We all know that McCain is our nominee because northeastern liberals voted for him in NH. This launched his campaign and McCain took advantage of a GOP primary system that was, ironically, rigged to nominate Rudy. No one expected people to have such short memories about McCain’s support of the amnesty bill, including his primary opponents. Had Rudy come out of NH as the frontrunner, I think Thompson would have taken him on and beat him. Instead, his senate colleague, John McCain came out ahead and that meant that Fred was never going to be competitive. He is too nice of a guy.
Still, Fred is who I am voting for in the general election (unless the feckless McCain selects a true conservative as his running mate and then promises to
May 13th, 2008 at 7:40 PMdrop deadretire around February 15th).Using
The Obama Rules
Published in May 13th, 2008
Rich Lowry outlines them in case you were confused:
Here are the Obama rules in detail: He can’t be called a “liberal” (”the same names and labels they pin on everyone,” as Obama puts it); his toughness on the war on terror can’t be questioned (”attempts to play on our fears”); his extreme positions on social issues can’t be exposed (”the same efforts to distract us from the issues that affect our lives” and “turn us against each other”); and his Chicago background too is off-limits (”pouncing on every gaffe and association and fake controversy”). Besides that, it should be a freewheeling and spirited campaign.
And oh yeah, they only apply to John McCain:
Democrats always want cultural issues not to matter because they are on the least-popular side of many of them, and want patriotic symbols like the Pledge of Allegiance and flag pins to be irrelevant when they can’t manage to nominate presidential candidates who wholeheartedly embrace them (which shouldn’t be that difficult). As for “fear” and “division,” they are vaporous pejoratives that can be applied to any warning of negative consequences of a given policy or any political position that doesn’t command 100 percent assent. In his North Carolina speech, Obama said the Iraq War “has not made us safer,” and that McCain’s ideas are “out of touch” with “American values.” How fearfully divisive.
We could take Obama’s rules in good faith if he never calls John McCain a “conservative” or labels him in any other way. If he never criticizes him for his association with George Bush. If he doesn’t jump on his gaffes (like McCain’s 100-years-in-Iraq comment that Obama distorted and harped on for weeks). And if he never says anything that would tend to make Americans fearful about the future or divide them (i.e., say things that some people agree with and others don’t).
This is, of course, an impossible standard. Obama doesn’t expect anyone to live up to it except John McCain.
May 13th, 2008 at 7:45 PMUsing
Im sure DJ is feeling pretty good about his boy Obamas chances after seeing all the “conservatives” here who wont vote for McCain
May 13th, 2008 at 7:46 PMUsing
Sorry dude, this comment makes no sense to me.
I implied that we should not have supported the moderate, Bob Dole. Because we did, conservatives reinforced the notion that we didn’t mind a RINO nominee. As it turned out, It actually would have been better if all conservatives had taken a longer view and voted for Perot (the less crazy version of Ron Paul).
The thing is, back then, conservatives were not really thinking that the party would spin out of control the way it has. Now that it has however, there is no longer any excuse for us to enable the evil that has taken hold of our party.
McCain and his ilk are a cancer that needs to be excised from the body politic. If it takes radical chemo in the form of 4 years of Obama, but we come out the other end with a strengthened conservative movement, then the pain will be well worth it.
Bottom line, my prescription is the clearly strategic one. OTOH, the one that supports McCain is only tactical and ultimately, will be disastrous for this country.
May 13th, 2008 at 7:53 PMUsing
Hoghead wrote:
What’s with the sneer quotes around the word “conservative”? The only people here who are “conservatives” are those supporting McCain.
May 13th, 2008 at 7:57 PMUsing
Probably. What’s yer point? That still leaves us with “vote for EVIL.”
Me, I’m gonna write in J.C. Watts. Just to let them know that they could have had my vote.
May 13th, 2008 at 7:58 PMUsing
[...] http://www.nicedoggie.net/2008/?p=776 [...]
May 13th, 2008 at 8:00 PMUsing
And on that note, Ladies and Gentlefolk, I’m crusin’. Keep the shiny side up, and have a great evening.
PeaceOut.
May 13th, 2008 at 8:00 PMUsing
What I would love to see is the following: In order to rule, politicians need to give up everything - bank accounts, summer homes on the Cape, limos, etc. They get to keep one house, one car and get a nominal stipend to live off. Considering the little amount of time they actually spend WORKING, they should get about $40,000 per year plus health insurance. No benefits for life. No special treatment. No taxpayer-funded anything except for their salary. THEN see how many of these pernicious yambags fall all over themselves to get elected. Maybe then, we’ll get people in office who actually want to SERVE.
May 13th, 2008 at 8:04 PMUsing
REALLY? There’s a world of difference between John “We can’t torture terrorist scumbags” McCain and Obambi? As someone who works in the intel field, I find that statement repugnant! McSwine wants to take away one of the most effective tools we have against terrorists! Why? Because he spent years being abused by the VietCong. While I appreciate his service, the Cong got what they wanted out of him via torture, didn’t they? They got him to sign their document confessing to war crimes. Hell, he admitted it worked on him! Now he wants to deny America the opportunity to get critical information out of suspects through waterboarding? FUCK HIM! I don’t give a flying rat’s ass if that asshole will keep us in Iraq another 50 years. What good is it if we can’t get the information we need to quell the terrorist threat?
May 13th, 2008 at 8:10 PMUsing
You wish. You, on the other hand, amuse me, bleakly, as living proof - along with Pighead (and what a fitting pair of monikers you are, Musclehead and Pighead) of the eternal urge of weak men to find something beyond their own hollowness to believe in.
True believers, both of you, in the notion that the lesser shit sandwich will always taste less revolting then the greater shit sandwich, and that a Republican somehow must always be better than a Democrat.
You, Musclehead, I’m not going to bother much with - an intellectual wrestling match with you is a waste of time. Just as rolling in the muck with hogs gets the rollee dirty but cheers the hogs, it would probably only make you happy. I’ll simply refer to a stretch of writing about McCain’s infamies by someone far beyond your intellectual ken (that would be me, lackwit): Suck on this for a while. I doubt it will do much to change whatever you are using for a mind this week (printing it out, wrapping it around the Holy Cluebat from Hell, and whacking you upside your skull probably wouldn’t produce anything but a hollow, booming sound), but what the heck, it’s worth a shot.
But Pighead - he’s a little more interesting. Not any brighter, but more…interesting.
Okay, Piggy, get a grip on your panties, because I’m about to rock your world.
I have that picture up there (and if you run your cursor - that little pointy thing, not the big pointy thing wobbly on your shoulders) across it, you will see the words “Never Forget.”
You obviously have forgotten. You’re gonna back Johnny Ego to the max because…he’s gonna fight terrorism? How? By continuing the Bush policies? By “staying the course” in Iraq?
Pighead, you drooling dumbass.
See, because I haven’t forgotten, I remember that almost all of the hijackers were Saudis. I remember that the leader of the gang of barbarian savages who pulled off the worst attack on the American homeland ever was a Saudi. And I remember how George Bush gave his Saudi pals a pass, even in the immediate aftermath of the deadly attack. I remember how Georgie Boy got up on his hind legs (for a few moments, at least) and spoke the truth: That there was an Axis of Evil, and that it numbers Iran, Iraq, and North Korea.
I remember that once upon a time you were either with us, or with the terrorists.
And I remember how he drenched his drawers and ran just as fast as he could from what he said as New York City smoldered, and ended up holding hands with the obese swine who runs a medieval monarchy on a dung heap floating on oil.
And I look around today, and I see Georgie pissing away hundreds of billions of dollars in Iraq, on the weird notion that some sort of Democracy that includes genital mutilation and beating your daughters to death is going to halt Islamofascism. I see the government of Saudi Arabia untouched, and the Saudi regime still pouring billions (some of which came out of our own pockets) into a worldwide network of mosques dedicated to our destruction. These are the scum Georgie Boy calls our “eternal friends and allies.”
Will Johnny Ego continue smooching the Saudis? Of course he will. I remember who the dogs and pigs were who slaughtered thousands of our people. Does he? Do you?
I remember that Iran was with the terrorists (because they sure weren’t with us). And I see how, today, Iran is on the brink of becoming the only nuclear power in the middle east. I see how Iran, via surrogates like Mookie al-Sadr and the Mahdi Militias (you’re probably stupid enough to think the Mahdi’s have been destroyed) and Maliki’s Badr Gangsters, founded in Iran and now becoming the official “security forces” of the government of Iraq, is on the verge of completing a soft takeover of the Shia provinces and achieving de facto control of the oil there. I see Syria hooting and laughing at us, and collaborating with Iran to launch a Hizb’Allah army against the fading government of Lebanon.
I see North Korea with nuclear weapons violating the laughable “agreement” with Georgie Boy before the ink even dried on the papers.
And I see Georgie Boy Bush doing fuckall to stop any of it. Instead, he wastes American lives to keep barbarian Sunnis and barbarian Shia from slaughtering each other, mostly because his Saudi pals don’t want to see the Iraqi Sunnis turned into charcoal.
I see all this, and I see you blabberwhacking along about how McCain is going to wage a better war on Islamofascism than Obama, and I reply, “You feckless tumblefart, What war on Islamofascism?”
The leadership of both American political parties is deeply corrupt. I have no interest in reforming the Democrats. Let them have all the commies, liberal fascists, schoolyard socialists, and America-hating leftards they can stomach. But I would like to save the GOP from becoming a pale imitation of the Party of the Red Flag and the sneaking, creeping Internationale.
It ain’t going to get done by you and your ilk dining on an endless banquet of lesser evil shit sandwiches. I’m not going to elaborate further on that - If you can’t figure it out from what Misha has already said, you’re beyond hope.
Hell, of course you’re beyond hope, you and Musclehead both. But the party might still be saved. That’s my project. Of course, I’m capable of thinking further ahead than ten minutes, my next beer, and a nice, satisfying shit sandwich.
You might try it sometime.
May 13th, 2008 at 8:25 PMUsing
Okay, all you political experts:
Nebraska had its primary today…both parties voting. So far, Clinton is ahead by a pretty substantial lead…I know that only 1% has reported, but most elections seem to be “called” with less. Here’s the problem. Several months ago, Nebraska had a democrat caucus, which Obama won, and was subsequently awarded the majority of the delegates for.
How does this work? Suppose Hitlery wins the election tonight?
1% OF PRECINCTS REPORTING
May 13th, 2008 at 8:34 PMClinton 5,715 55%
Obama 4,387 42%
Gravel 301 3%
Using
Mr. Quick:
So you want to save the GOP from becoming a pale imitation of the Party of the Red Flag? And allow the REAL commies to take over the country?
Once again, I ask that people look at my post about Michigan. And maybe read Gingrich’s book “Real Change”. I saw the carnage in Michigan firsthand.
But hey, Quickie, you go ahead and stand by your principles. Allow the “Nazis” to take over while you sit idly by and complain, complain, complain. You think running the country(and the world) is easy? Then go run for office, you pussy.
If the GOP ain’t elected again, then they aren’t in office. If they aren’t in office, they don’t exist. The party dies, and so does your power. Ain’t that a bitch?
And Hog Head ain’t no “Piggy” YOU ARE.
Dumbass.
Oh, by the way, I’m using words like “ain’t” so that you can understand what I’m saying.
May 13th, 2008 at 8:42 PMUsing
Damn!
Leave work & go home and all sorts of people start putting words in your mouth!
Okay then, in parts:
The Major, Volatile Agent Exemplar,
Uh… no - that’s not remotely what I mean.
By “unlike your others”, I meant… his other shortcomings, for which he may not compensate, even if he commits to try hard.
You know - just like it reads.
But hey! Don’t let a little thing like ‘reading in context’ interrupt your maintenance of ‘Teh Outrage’…
LC Wil,
At what point did I say that it wasn’t?
Please feel free to refer to comment #4, wherein I said:
Fine - your call.
I want to know how you envision an Obama Presidency - descibe what you imagine some of the most prominent features would be.
I just want to know that you’ve thought that part through.
…OR Comment #18, wherein I said:
Now, maybe I’m a little biased here - but so far, I don’t see anything that looks like me telling anyone else that their opinions of McCain are, in and of themselves, unfair.
At worst, it can be said that I have doubted the foresight of people saying “never-never-never-not-ever-in-a-million-years-no-matter-what!”
For some perspective, let’s re-visit:
#13 - Where Bill Quick’s reaction to my preference for McCain-over-Obama garnered the following:
…or
#17 - Wherein hitnrun bespeaks of the ThoughtCrime of dissent thusly:
See the difference?
I have never attacked nor cast dispersions on any of you for merely having a different opinion, nor suggested that you were somehow not allowed to have one.
I’ll debate the points, dispute the facts and even ridicule completely-unsupportable statements - sometimes, I’ll even mock bad behavior or (gasp) hit back.
Until now, none of that has seemed out-of-bounds.
Misha - you think I’m a troll, you let me know and I’ll save you the trouble of banning me.
- MuscleDaddy
May 13th, 2008 at 8:59 PMUsing
Wellp it took me a while to digest all this deep philosophical stuff regarding the state of our current political situation and its outlook. Being a rather simple man I think I’ll attempt to sum up in terms I can easily understand…..
WE ARE GOING TO GET FUCKED!
Now the next question is whether or not I’ll be some sort of particpant in the fucking by wear crotchless panties (voting), or be being dragged into the gangbang off the street (by not voting)
Next is which one of my serial rapist attackers has the most ongoing “urges” to repeatedly return to the proverbial “scene of the crime” and assault me again, and how many times am I to be assaulted during the course of the next four years (my sentence).
And finally the BIG HARD THROBBING QUESTION… What is my poor asshole going to look like after my “cell mate” gets paroled? …… Will I get another serial rapist cellmate? Will he be a rapist I kinda like (like he keeps other rapists from fucking me)? Or will he be a BUBBA intent on going where no man has gone before, while inviting his friends over for a ride too?
But being the pragmatic prison poet that I am …. I still recognize that WE ARE GOING TO GET FUCKED
Did I miss anything?
May 13th, 2008 at 9:03 PMUsing
Ah, Bill-Quick-The-Gweat-and-Tewwible returns…
Oh Sir! You cut me to the Quick!
Verily, I am undone by your Blogosphere-Naming-Magnificence!
And a Cluebat! Such terrifying images of violence!
I shall away at once, lest you next threaten me with the unstoppable might of Youtube, MySpace and Email!
Pathetic little man.
May 13th, 2008 at 9:10 PMUsing
#76 MD
That goes for me too.
#75 nerby
100% totally right on. Nerby flushes the douche down the drain he crawled out of. Thanks my friend!
May 13th, 2008 at 9:15 PMUsing
Just when did I suggest that?
Listen, everybody, before we have to move this to the Colisseum, it’s pretty well established that we’re never going to agree on this one. I respect that, and if I, of all people, can accept that, then I don’t see any reason why the rest of y’all shouldn’t be able to as well.
By all means debate, insult, go for the throat, but “troll?”
Really, now.
May 13th, 2008 at 9:18 PMUsing
#73 DoucheQuick
Kinda worked since 9-11 hasnt it? NO ATTACKS ON AMERICAN SOIL SINCE 9-11. Thank GOD for President Bush.
May 13th, 2008 at 9:18 PMUsing
Nicki:
Thank you for your service. You have the most important job on this earth: Protecting our ungrateful asses.
I think that McCain HAS been tainted by his FIVE years in torture, but I don’t believe that he would turn his back on our men and women serving this country.
He may not support interrogation methods, but he supports YOU.
May 13th, 2008 at 9:21 PMObama would trade your ass for a mussel in Florida.
Using
As Nicki has tried to remind us, fighting the GWOT takes more than a slogan. And McCain has made it perfectly clear that he is intent on fightig by Marquis of Queensbury rules. With no waterboarding, or anything else unpleasant. :em98: Or even clearly identifying who are and are not our enemies. And don’t think about doing anything that would opset our good and fashionable European friends. Yes, when McCain follows Osama to the gates of hell, he’ll eventually find him there - but then what? We won’t be able to actually do anything. And I don’t think McCain has the stones to take any serious measures against jihadis already here, particularly if they happen to be American citizens. Or even worse a Congressman. Or if they happen to be Iranians crossing the sacred non-border.
Some of you suggest that if we elect the old gomer this time, we’ll be able to vote for a conservative the next time. What gives you the assurance that McCain will permit a conservative to be nominated? Maybe he won’t drive them out or deny them any opportunity. That may depend on who is his running mate. And from what I hear, it sounds as if he wants The Huckster - that guy who wants to re-emgineer our entire lives with smoking bans, federal menus and dieting, national exercise mandates, and national bedtime. But some huckwits are impressed because he uses a Cross as an accessory - just like the singer Madonna.
Like some of the others here, I would prefer to face an opposition who is easily recognized as such, and not someone pretending to be our leader while leading us into an ambush.
Nor am I any longer impressed with the ambitious Mr. Gingrich. He did a great job a rallying the opposition to BJ in 1994, but as soon as he got the corner office, he started telling us we should let up and give the Clinton criminals a pass, and got himself booted out of office in only a couple terms. And Newt has tried to make a comeback by seeking to allign himself with the Hildebeeste’s health care plan - the very thing he formerly opposed. And now Newt is warming up for Environmental Algorythms, just as global warming begins to cool down.
May 13th, 2008 at 9:24 PMUsing
#73 DoucheQuick
Yeah, and then after a very few months, the boys you want to put BACK in power,(Democrats dumbass)
May 13th, 2008 at 9:26 PMgot all wobbly kneed and started enforcing FISA,trying to kill or defang the Patriot act, cutting badly needed War funds, voting for it before they voted against it, supporting the troops but not the mission, sicking move-on.org against our side, insisting on politicizing the 9-11 commissions findings, and generally undermining every Bush plan .Those are the guys you want to hand the keys to the white house back to. And you call me the dumbass?????????????????????????????????
Using
They’re gonna try, but I ain’t gettin fucked, ‘be gettin’ busy.
When the economy is good, people buy glass. When the economy is bad, glass gets broken.
BQ sure doesn’t leave ya any smarter with all that typin’ he does, wilted ba-da-boink insults.
I’d sure hate to be his dog.
He does seem to know something about lying,, not convincingly, but amusingly,, ‘reminds me of the feller in this song.
May 13th, 2008 at 9:33 PMThree biggest lies
Using
And for those who want to take this to the Supreme Court. Let me give a short list.
Earl Warren
William Brennan
Potter Stewart
Warren Burger
Lewis Powell
Harry Blackmun
Sandra Day O’Conner
Anthony Kennedy
David Souter
And Harriet Miers and Alberto Gonzales as close escapes.
May 13th, 2008 at 9:39 PMSuggest anything?
Using
I’m sad to see how “proud” you “conservatives” are on your ideology.
I just want to win the election to make sure that the socialist/commie agenda doesn’t take hold.
And it WILL if it’s given a chance.
Look at Michigan.
Read the posts from people in Colorado.
This insidious sweep of Leftist control is taking hold, and you sit here and argue about who is more conservative?
You are all self-defeating Idiots.
Obama equals higher taxes, fewer jobs and HELL.
May 13th, 2008 at 9:43 PMDon’t whine when you can’t pay your bills because the “libby” wants to “help” you
Using
TERM LIMITS …. TERM LIMITS ON EVERYTHING
POTUS = TWO
Congress = TWO period then your done
Reps…. TWO period then your done
Supreme Court … your done at 65 like eveybody else
Just a random thought … any disagreements out there? And if so why?
May 13th, 2008 at 9:44 PMUsing
But if I cant pay my bills … wont the liberal party social programs fill in the gaps? :em95:
May 13th, 2008 at 9:46 PMUsing
No matter WHO wins, you’re gonna need this:
10 Things To Do Before The Election:
1. Clean your rifle.
2. Clean your handgun.
3. Sharpen your knives.
4. Make sure everyone in your household knows how and when to use the items in 1, 2, and 3 above.
5. Lay in stocks of water purification supplies, ammo, any required medicines, and food in that order.
6. Make sure your vehicles’ gas tanks are always at least half full.
7. Map out escape routes from the cities to your SAFE area (Selected Area For Evasion).
Try to pick routes away from major traffic arteries.
8. If possible, preposition supplies from #5 at your SAFE area.
9. Since the trend is to burning property during riots, buy several inexpensive fire extinguishers.
10. KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT about your preparations.
May 13th, 2008 at 9:47 PMUsing
LC Rurik:
May 13th, 2008 at 9:50 PMI would prefer an “old gomer” to an inexperienced America-hater, race-bater any day.
Using
WEC…. those are all great suggestions….. but what makes you think that they wont go into a complete containment mode if the ballon goes up?
May 13th, 2008 at 9:53 PMUsing
KNZR 1560 AM host Jaz McKay posted a version of an “Obama ‘08″ logo followed by that phrase, as well as other slogans including “Hope. Change. Dead honkeys.” and “Yes we can. Kill white folks.”
May 13th, 2008 at 10:04 PMUsing
nerbygirl,
So far as it goes, I would too. We all would. Just so long as you don’t find yourself into getting both. :em95:
May 13th, 2008 at 10:11 PMUsing
Ok .. I’ll be serious now cause its an aspect that really hasnt been batted around. Im of the mind that Obama is currently setting race relations back at least 15 yrs. He talks about unifying stuff, but he is contributing to a racial divide by claiming that attacks on him are all based on race, and identifying parts of his ideological underpinings derive from being a “black man” (thereby drawing attention to race) vs. identifying his ideological undrepinings as being derived from his political affiliation. Then we add the militancy of his closest spiritual advisors… and frankly that scares people (white people). Ultimately he playe dthe race card first, he continues to play it …. and it is not beneficial to unity, it is eroding and divisive. And very very few want to discuss this aspect of Obama in regards to his ‘”electability”, but there is a reality here…. McCain could pull a win on this aspect alone. f enough white people get fearful…. Obama will never see the WH
May 13th, 2008 at 10:17 PMUsing
As an LC, I have unwavering respect for our Emperor, even when we disagree. I’ve read many times his plights under European socialism, and applaud his escape and embracing of the American Way. But:
I can understand our Emperor’s paradigm, but, umm, THIS IS AMERICA! We aren’t socialist YET! We don’t have rag-tag ballot box-stuffing mock elections here YET! We have a G-D breathed CONSTITUTION that has been the anvil that has worn out many hammers.
Pragmatism and wisdom has prevailed after Bush vs. Gore. Algore won by 543895 popular votes, and Bush won by 5 electoral votes. A RAZOR THIN victory for Bush. Conclusion: A vote for anyone but McLame is a vote for a European-style socialist.
What if Al Whore was POTUS during 9-11? That cock-sucker would have groveled on his knees to the muslim-FUCKS! Hell, He may have even bombed an aspirin factory the day before the 9-11 commission to appease his legacy. The same holds true today. Who do you want to have control of our war machine after the next GUARANTEED attack: a cowardly Euro-socialist-wannabe traitorous democrap, or a warrior who proved his metal in aerial combat, and in a bamboo cage.
McCain was never, EVER on my short list of candidates, but I’m going to vote for the defense of our country. I’m not going to WASTE my vote for Joe-Shit-Nobody so I can say “see, I told you so.” If any of you jerk-off’s call me a RINO, FUCK YOU. I am hard-right to the core. I’m just smart enough to do the right thing when I have to.
May 13th, 2008 at 10:19 PMUsing
Politics has been described as the art of the possible.
May 13th, 2008 at 10:22 PMAt this point in time it’s not possible to put up a truly conservative Republican candidate for President.
So the lesser of two evils argument becomes germane.
Do you put an Obama there and give him 4 years to really stack the deck? Because that’s why things are where they are. For a few decades, Liberals have been stacking the deck. Incrementally, steadily, graduating class by graduating class, revisionist history book by revisionist history book, they’ve created a couple of generations of people who have come to accept a different paradigm of societal expectations.
They’ve come to accept it and have been deluded into thinking it’s possible. Logic and critical intellect have been diluted in the population. Political power is always in the hands of the swinging voter and the swing has gone left and it won’t go back again until it gets to the point where they’re hurting.
So, the question becomes, do you minimise the effects of the Left and hope the pendulum swings back gradually while you fight a rear guard action or do you let the Left really fuck it up and have a radical reaction guaranteed but 8 or ten years of real pain? If Obama gets in it will take at least the full first term of a Republican Conservative to undo his screwups. probably longer.
At a time when the rest of the world is in such flux and two old superpowers are again flexing their muscles, I don’t think it’s the right time to go for the slash and burn. Too much to lose for Obama to be thrown the football.
Using
Deej:
And all you could put up for candidates are a man who has no experience running ANYTHING, and a political whore.
Either way, the American people have been indoctrinated by the media to vote for either one, because BUSH is so EVIIIIIIIIIIL. He wasn’t perfect, but he certainly wasn’t evil.
Go to Michigan, my liberal friend. Talk to the unemployed and disenfranchised in that State.
And then picture their lives across America.
The Unions destroyed Michigan, not the workers. The workers just voted he way that they were told to .
And they lost their jobs anyway…
I’m a Union member..I get it.
I was hoping for a candidate who really cared. I now just hope that the commie/socialist Democrats don’t destroy this country the way they destroyed the formerly GREAT state of Michigan.
May 13th, 2008 at 10:22 PMUsing
Before you vote, you owe it to YOUR COUNTRY to watch this !!!
http://www.eyeblast......srcID=2036
May 13th, 2008 at 10:23 PMUsing
IF after watching the above you still think Obama cant be worse (or is just as bad) as McCain, YOU NEED TO SEEK PROFESSIONAL HELP.
May 13th, 2008 at 10:30 PMUsing
That about says it ALL>
May 13th, 2008 at 10:38 PMUsing
AMEN BROTHER!
May 13th, 2008 at 10:42 PMUsing
From a long term perspective an Obama/Democrat led retreat in the War on Terror could have a positive effect.
History Time: The Federalist Party was fairly pro-British at the time of the War of 1812. The Fed’s allowed for a pretty pro-British settlement in the Treaty of Ghent which ended the war. When Andy Jackson won at New Orleans (after the Treaty was signed) the Federalists looked like, well, appeasers and defeatists. The party had been weakening over time and the Treaty of Ghent was the nail in the Federalist Coffin. The Democrats were for a while the only game in town until the rise of the Republicans.
The Democrats have been pulling themselves more and more out of the mainstream, a Federalist/1812 collaspe is not out of the question for the Democrats if the insist on surrendering on the War on Terror. Another 9/11 would be the Democrats Battle of New Orleans.
May 13th, 2008 at 11:05 PMUsing
This “debate” is getting old. As I remarked to Misha, there’s an old saying: If you convinced me, and I convinced you, wouldn’t there STILL be two points of view?
Most of us have made up our minds. Can’t we all just agree to disagree?
May 13th, 2008 at 11:07 PMUsing
We don’t have rag-tag box-stuffing mock elections? The Chicago “machine” stuffed the ballot box for Kennedy. My dad was an observer when the votes were counted. For every one Nixon got, Kennedy *somehow* got two or more…Papa Joe bought the election for his boy.
How about poor Michigan and Florida? Their electorate this year was cheated out of their votes by a certain political witch-who-would-be-president.
Remember the Florida recounts? With Algore suing to get the USSC to appoint him president?
When the dems win the popular vote but lose the electorate, they want to abolish the electoral college.
How about judges declaring, despite state election laws, that polls could remain open until the next morning? Or the polls which allow in other observers besides just the judges before the ballots are counted?
You were saying something about our constitution???
May 13th, 2008 at 11:15 PMUsing
Kenashimame,
Neither Hillary nor Obama will make good on their promise to end the war. They can’t afford to. It would be political suicide and would guarantee them only one term. If the democrats were serious about ending the war, it would be done by now. It’s all posturing and pandering.
They are too politically savvy not to know that the resulting blood-bath would render null their chances for reelection, and quite possibly put a republican BACK in the WH.
May 13th, 2008 at 11:19 PMUsing
in 1812 they were throwing cannon balls, now they’re throwing dirty nukes and bioweapons…..is rendering the democrat party irrelevant really worth the risk of another 9/11?
Stick to your principles fellow LC’s…..write in Fred or whomever you see as the dream candidate….or throw your vote away by voting for that idiot Bob Barr…..anybody but McCain right? Throw it away in the name of high principle, or better yet, go visit the wounded veterans in any military hospital and remember who you should be voting for……
Don’t know who said this, I cut it from HOGHEAD’s comment, but ROGER THAT!!! especially that last line……
Remember what’s on the line here and look past your own principles a little.
May 13th, 2008 at 11:42 PMUsing
I posted a similar rant to this last month
IS THIS HOW MCSHAMNESTY EXPECTS TO GET THE CONSERVATIVE VOTE?
This guy is really beginning to seriously burn my ass! It’s not like I’ve already been pissed at this Liberal in sheep’s clothing, but, he’s just getting worse at lambasting conservatives on a daily basis. There is no way in hell I can vote for this prick. Now the asshole is talking about global warmongering legislation if he gets elected? WTF? Why do we want some bastard that can’t even read a freakin’ scientific report that refutes all the previous manipulated reports? Asshole! If this prick gets in office, he’ll just continue to tank our economy and the future of this country. Having him in there will be no better than Obamarama Lama Ding Dong and Shillary.
God save us all!
May 13th, 2008 at 11:54 PMUsing
LC SkyeChild G.L.O.R.
I actually edited out “(mostly)” from my comment. I knew a sharp LC would conjur up voting fraud incidents in the past, but these are NOTHING compared to Misha’s past life in No-Constitutionstan from which he came. We all know that when it comes to voting fraud, the demofucks cornered the market years ago. my point is, we ain’t no piece-o-shit 3rd world country YET. There isn’t nation-wide corruption like elsewhere.
Uh, that’s because these states jumped on the “We wanna be first” bandwagon against the rules of the game that the parties SPELLED OUT BEFORE THE ELECTION. Blame egos, not voting fraud.
But they didn’t, did they? The CONSTITUTION prevailed.
Lawyers, hanging chads, not counting military mail-in ballots, moronic asshole liberal lawyers… despite all these ATTEMPTS, Bush won. Would he have won under similar circumstances in Bumfuck Egypt? No. The system worked.
You’re damned right I was! It was either a non-sequitur or victorious in all of your rebuttals. Any more questions?
May 13th, 2008 at 11:57 PMUsing
No, you’re using words like ain’t because you were raised in a barn by retards. And it shows.
But the pussy thing. That’s pretty funny. Somebody write that for you?
May 14th, 2008 at 12:08 AMUsing
Wel,let me sum up the problem of the Republican party and the Conservative base . if McCain wins , The Republican party will be in big trouble for a long time and the country will get screwed and if Obama wins , the country gets screwed now and depending how bad is the screw up and the cover-up, about eight years to 16 years if the country is lucky and if not , one uncompleted term and an American city glowing in the dark witj millions dead and a possible coup-de-etat and nuke retaliation to follow ( I really hope not ). I agree with Misha that the conservatives and libertarians should concentrate on local and state governments as well as the Congress and Senate and we should start now to at least win 2010 . We must concentrate on creating a massive conservative grass roots program NOW while we have time. Organize now while we have Bush as president because if Obama gets the keys to the WH, Freedom of Speech will become a one way street . Let’s wage a guerilla information warfare now while we have the resources to do so,kick start it and fast . I have this feeling that this blog and others like it will be silence by lawsuits so better get a move-on . Find conservatives who adhere to small-government , decrease spending and flat tax and who are willing to run for local and state office for two terms only . Let us not let the Unions turn your cities and states into a repeat of Chicago and Illinois .Once you put mayors and governors who are pandering to unions . You will have a fucking hard time to get them out of office especially when the Unions wish to removed the secret ballot provision and forcing everyone by hook or by crook to be unionized .Once we get our guys into the city councils and state legislature , we can stop them from making our jobs an automatic vote for the union and the Idiocrats . If we cripple Big Labor by exposing the rank and file to the corruption of their union bosses and their connection with the Democratic party,the unions will be out of play for the Democratic party for the longest time
Second , Destroy the Established Press from the inside out and from the outside . That powers the Democratic party as well as the idiotic Republicans in name only. Expose their agenda , humiliate them nationally and internationally . Make them make unforced errors and hammer them hard and ruthlessly . Do what the Left did to the formerly conservative press. Infiltrate by going inside , buying their stocks and getting into the board room and own the damn thing .
Third. Academia . This is the perfect recruitment ground for the Left . Captive audiences makes political indoctrination easier and permanent especially when the parents are taken out by judicial and legislative fiat . The Younger they are, the better . Solution , Hit them hard with lawsuits , conservative, libertarian and centrist parents should and must control the PTA and the school board since Home schooling would become a form of child abuse once the leftist do gooders get their way .
Fourth , Second Amendment . Don’t be surprised when all guns will be banned . If you think the Brady law is bad enough, wait until PETA and other anti gun groups lobby the Democratic Congress for the virtually removal of the Second Amendment out of the US Constitution and they will succeed and don’t think that Obama won’t sign the damn blasted thing for the sake of the children . The NRA,gun manufacturers and legitimate gun resellers and owners will be sued ,tried and force to pay heavy fines in addition to having your guns consfiscated and destroyed . Guys , start telling your friends to prepare for this legally .Prepare to fight it out for the next four years legally and remember guerilla warfare guys . Hit those anti gun bastards where it hurts the most , their pocket .
Let us work together now because if Obama wins , we will have a long four years ahead of us .And if McCAin wins , we better start looking for those conservatives , fast .
May 14th, 2008 at 12:23 AMUsing
This is getting bizarre. :em41: On one side we’ve got Obamadinejad, who promises to “unify” the nation (makes me think of Gleichschaltung), but cannot unify he own party, or for that matter his own weekly spin.
On the other I hear the paladins of McCain, who are demanding that Republicans shut the fuck up and in behalf of freedom, obey orders, the way Johnny never has done.
Okay, you McCain champions with your heavy-handed hectoring have finally convinced me. :em02: See? I can listen to reason and force. I declare that I’m switching to McCain - but not so much to listening, but instead to emulating him. I’m going to be a maverick too, just like John. :em93: I’m going to follow his example and refuse to heed party discipline. I will stay home and let him be elected with the votes of all his friends fom across the aisle, and the border. That’s what being a maverick is all about. isn’t it. This is perhaps how Orthodox Republicans must have felt for the last 24 years. What goes around comes around.
May 14th, 2008 at 12:27 AMUsing
At the risk of getting caught up in what may become a flame war, allow me to put in a few thoughts here for the first time since being named an LC years ago by His Imperial Majesty. I have an online newsletter on political and military affairs. No, this is not link-whoring. It goes out by email kind of like a telephone tree. During the primary process, the choice of a Republican nominee was a matter of great import on the various Branches. Triggered largely by the rantings of one of my “Gentle Readers” who a) believed that anyone who had not fought in Vietnam, regardless of age, medical status, etc. was a “Yellow-Livered Draft Dodger”, b) that John Sidney McCain walked above water, c) expressed contempt for the concepts of representative democracy, a Republic, and the Constitution, and d) that John Sidney McCain should [literally] be the dictator of the United States for he could do no wrong; I did a 53 page analysis of McCain and his stands. It annoyed the “Gentle Reader” no end. If you disagreed with him, you were dubbed a YLDD. He is no longer one of my “Gentle Readers”, in no small part because he shared McCain’s tendency to refer to I and my fellow Americans of Asian ancestry as “gooks”.
In any case, my analysis broke down his statements, stands, and legislation; along with his two near misses at jumping to the Democrats. And his voting record, especially since he began his campaign. There are databases of votes. As of February 2008 he had missed half of the votes in the Senate this session. Some of this is explainable by his campaigning. What I looked at in detail was his record when the Democrats were trying to force an immediate surrender. That was when his presence was most important, because in the Senate we literally needed every vote to hold back Harry Reid, et. al. On examination, John McCain could be depended on to miss those votes. Interestingly, for a number of those votes, he made the ones before and after the critical ones. He was in the Capitol, but not there for the vote. He apparently did not want to publicly oppose his liberal Democrat friends where it counted with his vote in the Senate.
This is not someone who I feel will stand up against the enemy in this war. Indeed, the only people who he will consistently fight, are the Conservatives in the Republican Party.
If B. Hussein Obama or Hillary Diane Rodham Clinton are elected president, our country is in for a terrible trial. It may not survive. But I see no functional difference, especially on the war where he would have to fight the Democrats to continue the war [remember, Congress must pass the funding], when he is functionally a Democrat in all but name. In reference to his ACU rating, in February my first clue to check his Senate attendence record was a statement by the Chairman of the ACU that he had not made enough votes this session to be rated., and at that time the 2007 ratings were not compiled. I think this year he will be well below 50%. 15 years ago, he may have voted conservative but for the last 10 years he has sided with the enemy. I do not see him doing anything major to oppose Democrats, so we will have that same terrible trial if McCain is president. We will have the functional choice in November of voting for either a Liberal Democrat who will follow Marxist orders or a Marxist. That is not a choice worth making.
We are at the intersection of a number of bad trends. We are in the middle of a war that is literally existential. If we lose, we die as a nation and culture. We have lost most of the “virtues” that made us the City on a Hill, at least in our ruling elites. We are dependent on our worst enemies for economic survival, and at least half of our elites are siding with the enemy. And our political system is dysfunctional.
Looking at American history, political parties rise and fall every couple of generations. We no longer have Whigs, Federalists, Grange, “Know-Nothings”, etc. because they have faded away. The Republicans themselves were born out of the collapse of the Whigs 1854-1860. With the exception of Bob LaFollette’s Progressives and Teddy Roosevelt’s Bull Moose parties; we have been frozen in the same party structure for a century and a half. Although both major parties today have evolved to a certain extent, neither is capable of dealing with today’s realities. Right now, both parties are in the midst of collapse with the Republicans collapsing a bit faster.
Our political system cannot cope with the present reality. We are going to suffer. We may lose this country, destroyed from either within or without. There is no political party today that is serious about the war. We have won the first series of battles in Iraq and in Afghanistan, but I see no one after January 2009 who will not give back all we have gained. Our enemies are approaching access to the ability to strike us at home with nuclear or biological WMD, and we are too paralyzed to do anything about it. Indeed, we are conveniently leaving them a route in.
It is a fact, that whether we are relatively free, or if either of the major parties gets its wish to impose its own variant of dictatorship; we are going to be hit. We are going to lose one or more American cities. We are going to endure terrorism here on our own soil on a scale as yet unimagined. None of our political parties can face up to the facts of the nature of the war, the Century War, that we are engaged in. Millions of Americans are going to die. We may fold after they do. We shall see if we are capable of recovering. But I know that if the Republican party is in the White House, acting as Democrats, we will not be able to rebuild a Conservative movement to take back our country.
Bill Quick was talking about starting now to organize another party, a Constitution Party, to perhaps eventually replace what is now Democrat-lite. I admit that I have not checked back to see how that is going in some time. But I see that or something similar as our only hope to rebuild AFTER we suffer a time of blood and fire. It is too late, far too late, for us to reclaim the political system now before the organic waste impacts the rotating airfoil.
All we have left at this point is our faith in our conception of God, our oaths to the Constitution, and the hope that the incredible generation that stands under arms defending us can both hold back the Long Night AND defend the Constitution against ‘enemies domestic’.
In the meantime, we have to avoid enabling tyrants [of either party] and stand and fight as best we can at whatever level we can. I will support Conservatives down ticket. I cannot support a Democrat, even if he has an ‘R’ after his name. And I know that this is not going to be quick, it is going to hurt, and we are not going to like it. I will close with a quote from Melanie Phillips, the author of Londinistan:
We are now in a world where the only calculation to be made is between rocks and hard
places. There are no good options.
Subotai Bahadur
May 14th, 2008 at 12:42 AMUsing
DJ: Please, I wish they would! I’d vote for the troll over any of them. Face it, neither of the Dims has his appeal either.
May 14th, 2008 at 1:50 AMUsing
People who make these kind of statements simply do not understand that a vote for McCain is a vote for a socialist/commie agenda. McCain is a slow poison that will kill the conservative movement if not the Republican party itself.
Put simply, this is what it comes down to:
McCain as POTUS, conservatism dies. When conservatism dies, the country as we knew it dies.
Obama as POTUS, conservatism thrives. When conservatism thrives, the country eventually thrives.
So vote with your blinders on, with your tactical, short-term thinking and try to get McCain elected. It will be the death of the republic.
May 14th, 2008 at 7:04 AMUsing
Just remember ladies and gents, Ideology can be dangerous. The loony left is a great example of that.
May 14th, 2008 at 7:06 AMUsing
[...] is now in session, Professor Misha is [...]
May 14th, 2008 at 8:09 AMUsing
DJ,
Popular belief is easy to accept when it is mostly liberals, both Dem and Rep, that call for an end (I know that is an over generalization) to the 2nd Amendment. The fact that they call for the end of handgun ownership, except for them and their personal bodyguards, shows them to be hypocrites of the highest order. Note that gun ownership, based on most liberal stated views, is anathema to them, hence it will be a very small minority of liberals who carry or own guns. Conservatives, on the other hand, own and carry most of the guns. I’ll take those odds.
May 14th, 2008 at 8:12 AMUsing
NerbyGirl
Do you have any principles that you are proud of? That you’re willing to stand for? Willing to die for?
Have you really looked at what happened in both of those states??? Because I would submit that each of those is a microcosm of what we’re facing in the national election now. Both states have run miserable, Republican-lite candidates for long enough that the center has been redefined as somewhere left of Michael Dukakis. Both states are headed down the shithole because both (R) and (D) politicians (with a very few exceptions) legislate and govern on the left.
THAT is exactly what we’re headed for nationally … even if “Savior” McVain is elected. How is McVain better than Obama? Let me count the ways …
Supreme Court? McVain: no one left of Ginsburg, no one right of Souter. Obama: no one left of Ginsburg, no one right of Souter.
Appeasement of/Compliance with “World” opinion? McVain: Attention/Approval Whore. Obama: Attention/Approval Whore.
Middle East/War on Terror? McVain: no withdrawal from Iraq (probable draw down), weakening of intelligence gathering, likely to continue pressuring Israel to sell out for peace. Obama: no withdrawal from Iraq (definite draw down), weakening of intelligence gathering, partial or complete diplomatic undermining of Israel.
Nationalized Health Care? McVain: will come out against it, but bend over and sign whatever his buddy Kennedy puts in front of him. Obama: Has no real plan of his own, will sign whatever Dems put in front of him.
Taxes/Government Spending? McVain: “read my lips”, will bend over and sign whatever his buddy Kennedy puts in front of him. Increased taxes and spending ensue. Obama: Increased taxes and spending ensue.
Illegal Immigration? McVain: open borders, amnesty. Obama: open borders, amnesty.
Sorry ….. I’m just not seeing a whole lot of difference between the two.
I’m arguing that the big “difference” - that you and those who agree with you are beating your collective chests about - isn’t really much of a difference at all. I’m not trying to convince you that you shouldn’t vote for McVain. I’m just calling “bullshit” on your excuses for doing so.
Let’s see …. from the “lesser of two evils” crowd I’ve seen relativism, justifications/excuses for compromising principles, and now name-calling. Hallmarks of the left, or the right?
This, and someone else’s reference to Obama being the end of the USA, really do take the cake. This country, which has survived civil and world wars, the Great Depression, and the presidency of Jimmy Carter, will not end or be damaged beyond repair. It will survive and rise to greatness again … but not by the hands of people like McVain, or other “centrists” who would follow him.
I shudder to think what this world would be like if Lincoln or Truman had listened to “lesser of two evil” types.
May 14th, 2008 at 9:31 AMUsing
After she originally agreed to go along with the DNC’s ruling. Now, she’s crying like a baby cause she didn’t get her way.
May 14th, 2008 at 9:50 AMUsing
hmmmmmm….wonder why he would do that? maybe it had something to do with stopping corrupt democrat party hack election supervisors from softening the rules of recount for the 6th time. Bush won all five recounts in the cherry picked counties of Dade and Broward, only to have these so-called “supervisors” manipulate the rules for counting the ballots. They went from recounting “hanging chads” to counting “dimpled chads” to counting “pregnant chads” to personally determining “voter intent”………..
shit, I’d sue too to stop that kind of election fraud too….I’m glad Bush took it to the SCOTUS. Now why didn’t you or the other voter disenfranchisement whiners holler about those eeeeevil Diebold voting machines when the dhimmicrats won in 2006? I don’t think anything changed since ‘04 did it?
May 14th, 2008 at 10:22 AMUsing
John McCain’s remarks about the Pledge of Allegiance
‘The Pledge of Allegiance’ - by Senator John McCain
‘As you may know, I spent five and one half years as a prisoner of war during the Vietnam War. In the early years of our imprisonment, the NVA kept us in solitary confinement or two or three to a cell. In 1971 the NVA moved us from these conditions of isolation into large rooms with as many as 30 to 40 men to a room.
This was, as you can imagine, a wonderful change and was a direct result of the efforts of millions of Americans on behalf of a few hundred POWs 10,000 miles from home.
One of the men who moved into my room was a young man named Mike Christian.
Mike came from a small town near Selma , Alabama . He didn’t wear a pair of shoes until he was 13 years old. At 17, he enlisted in the US Navy. He later earned a commission by going to Officer Training School Then he became a Naval Flight Officer and was shot down and captured in 1967. Mike had a keen and deep appreciation of the opportunities this country and our military provide for people who want to work and want to succeed.
As part of the change in treatment, the Vietnamese allowed some prisoners to receive packages from home. In some of these packages were handkerchiefs, scarves and other items of clothing.
Mike got himself a bamboo needle. Over a period of a couple of months, he created an American flag and sewed on the inside of his shirt.
Every afternoon, before we had a bowl of soup, we would hang Mike’s shirt on the wall of the cell and say the Pledge of Allegiance.
I know the Pledge of Allegiance may not seem the most important part of our day now, but I can assure you that in that stark cell it was indeed the most important and meaningful event.
One day the Vietnamese searched our cell, as they did periodically, and discovered Mike’s shirt with the flag sewn inside, and removed it.
That evening they returned, opened the door of the cell, and for the benefit of all of us, beat Mike Christian severely for the next couple of hours. Then, they opened the door of the cell and threw him in. We cleaned him up as well as we could.
The cell in which we lived had a concrete slab in the middle on which we slept Four naked light bulbs hung in each corner of the room.
As I said, we tried to clean up Mike as well as we could. After the excitement died down, I looked in the corner of the room, and sitting there beneath that dim light bulb with a piece of red cloth, another shirt and his bamboo needle, was my friend, Mike Christian. He was sitting there with his eyes almost shut from the beating he had received, making another American flag. He was not making the flag because it made Mike Christian feel better. He was making that flag because he knew how important it was to us to be able to Pledge our allegiance to our flag and country.
So the next time you say the Pledge of Allegiance, you must never forget the sacrifice and courage that thousands of Americans have made to build our nation and promote freedom around the world. You must remember our duty, our honor, and our country.’
—————————————————————————————————————————————
oh….and then you have this clown, who refuses to place his hand on his heart and say the pledge……
May 14th, 2008 at 10:34 AMUsing
BigDogg,
I really think that you’re giving Obama too much credit for reason, and not enough credit for potential damage.
Also,
Where are you coming from with that?
Seriously - you’re bagging on people for admitting that they’re going for the “Lesser of Two Evils” - and then turn around and try to attribute some kind of “Savior” appellation to those same people?
That’s just dishonest.
- MuscleDaddy
May 14th, 2008 at 11:16 AMUsing
Jaybear
Yes, the stakes are higher, weapon wise, now as opposed to 1812. Yes, another 9/11 would be a tragedy, but would another 9/11 be a bigger tragedy than continuing on the path we’re on?
With McCain, you’re counting on the strategy of engaging the enemy in his backyard to prevent another attack. It’s worked so far, but what happens when some bright boy at Al Queda realizes that the strategy can work in reverse and walks his dirty bomb across the border that Gauis Frakkin’ McCain will leave open?
May 14th, 2008 at 11:30 AMUsing
Why waterboard ‘em when you can pitch ‘em out an airlock?
When you’re tired of voting for the lesser evil.
May 14th, 2008 at 11:37 AMUsing
“It’s worked so far, but what happens when some bright boy at Al Queda realizes that the strategy can work in reverse and walks his dirty bomb across the border that Gauis Frakkin’ McCain will leave open?”
And allowing Shrillary or Obama to take charge would change that how? Sorry boys and girls. I knew the televison engineers who dies in the WTC attack. I’m not about to let a democrat president anywhere near the white house. Principals? Yeah, right. They can post them on your tombstone.
May 14th, 2008 at 12:24 PMUsing
Guys, I hope you’ll allow me some general remarks and praise from my distinctly European conservative perspective.
This blog is one of the few places you can find today where real political debate is both possible and practiced. There are many places and websites (especially in Europe) where people gather and moan and bitch about certain issues and problems they perceive in politics. We have many places where people talk about the dangers of Islamic Imperialism, of Socialism and other things.
But there are very few places where people exchange ideas about actual politics, about candidates and about the actual way the country could be going.
I appreciate very highly the possibility to witness this, and believe me: This is the reason why the United States of America are and will always be my number 1 destination if I ever had to flee from Europe, because it finally descended into fully Dhimmitude becoming a part of the New Caliphate.
I still think this is the only place where a man can come to with nothing but a big olive green backpack on his back, his wife and kids in tow and start again in liberty and freedom.
I admire and salute you for your love and passion for your country.
May 14th, 2008 at 12:36 PMUsing
For those of you who THINK you know, I present McCAins positions on guns
Protecting Second Amendment Rights
John McCain believes that the right of law abiding citizens to keep and bear arms is a fundamental, individual Constitutional right that we have a sacred duty to protect. We have a responsibility to ensure that criminals who violate the law are prosecuted to the fullest, rather than restricting the rights of law abiding citizens. Gun control is a proven failure in fighting crime. Law abiding citizens should not be asked to give up their rights because of criminals - criminals who ignore gun control laws anyway.
Gun Manufacturer Liability
John McCain opposes backdoor attempts to restrict Second Amendment rights by holding gun manufacturers liable for crimes committed by third parties using a firearm, and has voted to protect gun manufacturers from such inappropriate liability aimed at bankrupting the entire gun industry.
“Neither justice nor domestic peace are served by holding the innocent responsible for the acts of the criminal.”
-Senator John McCain
Assault Weapons
John McCain opposes restrictions on so-called “assault rifles” and voted consistently against such bans. Most recently he opposed an amendment to extend a ban on 19 specific firearms, and others with similar characteristics.
Importation of High Capacity Magazines
John McCain opposes bans on the importation of certain types of ammunition magazines and has voted against such limitations.
Gun Locks
John McCain believes that every firearms owner has a responsibility to learn how to safely use and store the firearm they have chosen, whether for target shooting, hunting, or personal protection. He has supported legislation requiring gun manufacturers to include gun safety devices such as trigger locks in product packaging.
Banning Ammunition
John McCain believes that banning ammunition is just another way to undermine Second Amendment rights. He voted against an amendment that would have banned many of the most commonly used hunting cartridges on the spurious grounds that they were “armor-piercing.”
DC Personal Protection
As part of John McCain’s defense of Second Amendment rights, he cosponsored legislation to lift a ban on the law abiding citizens of the District of Columbia from exercising their Constitutional right to bear arms.
Criminal Background Checks
John McCain supports instant criminal background checks to help prohibit criminals from buying firearms and has voted to ensure they are conducted thoroughly, efficiently, and without infringing on the rights of law abiding citizens.
Background Checks at Gun Shows
At a time when some were trying to shut down gun shows in the name of fighting crime, John McCain tried to preserve gun shows by standardizing sales procedures. Federal law requires licensed firearm sellers at gun shows to do an instant criminal background check on purchasers while private firearm sellers at gun shows do not have to conduct such a check. John McCain introduced legislation that would require an instant criminal background check for all sales at gun shows and believes that such checks must be conducted quickly to ensure that unnecessary delays do not effectively block transactions.
The Firearm Purchase Waiting Period
John McCain has opposed “waiting periods” for law abiding citizen’s purchase of firearms.
The confiscation of firearms after an emergency
John McCain opposes the confiscation of firearms from private citizens, particularly during times of crisis or emergency. He voted in favor of an amendment sponsored by Senator David Vitter prohibiting such confiscation.
Stiffer Penalties for Criminals who use a Firearm in the Commission of a Crime
John McCain believes in strict, mandatory penalties for criminals who use a firearm in the commission of a crime or illegally possess a firearm. Enforcing the current laws on the books is the best way to deter crime.
http://www.johnmccain.com
May 14th, 2008 at 12:51 PMUsing
Panzermann,
Thanks for your kind words - sometimes, we get so wrapped up in the process of the debate that we forget to consider the wonder inherent in the larger picture of the debate itself occurring at all.
Nice to be reminded.
Let us know if you need to do the olive-backpack-family-in-tow thing.
- MuscleDaddy
May 14th, 2008 at 1:58 PMUsing
MD@78
Muscle daddy…pity the fool and his pathetic little blog. Quicks blog stats = 9years, 4.5 million hits////Mishas blog = 6 years, 8.7 million hits. Quick has penis envy.
May 14th, 2008 at 2:01 PMUsing
FINALLY…..there IS HOPE
This comes to us via Edward Luttwack in the New York Times.
Luttwack says:
As the son of the Muslim father, Senator Obama was born a Muslim under Muslim law as it is universally understood. It makes no difference that, as Senator Obama has written, his father said he renounced his religion. Likewise, under Muslim law based on the Koran his mother’s Christian background is irrelevant.
*
With few exceptions, the jurists of all Sunni and Shiite schools prescribe execution for all adults who leave the faith not under duress; the recommended punishment is beheading at the hands of a cleric, although in recent years there have been both stonings and hangings.
May 14th, 2008 at 2:23 PMUsing
Am I the only one who thinks this is uncalled for?
May 14th, 2008 at 2:44 PMUsing
In that particular context?
May 14th, 2008 at 3:24 PMYep.
Umm, do you know where you are?
Using
Panzerman!
You’ve nailed the precise reasons I stick around.
Clarity and methodical accuracy in examining all the aspects of all the topics bantered will always be the foundation of this incredible forum Misha has provided, at no small exertion or expense.
Ripping away veneers of idiotarian ignorance to watch them burst into fire like bare-assed vampires in the sun is the best exercise for the minds that tend to linger here, and with the eloquence that is The Rottweiler Hallmark, not for the delicate of psyche.
We call these hypersensitive, touchyfeely folks of no informational substance “chewtoys”.
For all of his sacrifice to provide us with a forum to compare all of our collective observations and experiences, I intend to do my best to see him amused as well as enlightened.
On so many levels, it’s just the right thing to do.
The Bavarians I’ve shown this site to were simply amazed. Then very curious. Then after I’d given a tour of the links I found here at the Rott, they were not happy at all with all of the world news they discovered being actively kept from them.
Veneers are peeling away, thanks to Misha and the Crew.
Und, wenn kommt ihr fur eine holiday? Ich suche ein deutsche sprache lehrer mit eine gesmakt fur Haus gebraut bier.
May 14th, 2008 at 3:51 PMHoffenlich, das ist deine selb?
Using
Hoghead, invite Mr Quick to the coliseum if you want to make comments like that.
May 14th, 2008 at 3:57 PMUsing
How did you miss asking that about Quick’s screeds?
- MuscleDaddy
May 14th, 2008 at 4:00 PMUsing
Regardless of who started it, and I also remember a comment directed at MuscleDaddy calling him “troll” for having a differing opinion, so there’s plenty of blame to go around, if it is to continue that way, then it will be continuing in the Colisseum.
Which is fine by me, really.
May 14th, 2008 at 4:07 PMUsing
New ‘eco-friendly’ campaign merchandise not pandering to the left, McCain camp says…
as a Californian, i’m with Hoghead, and plan to vote for McCain,as that will be the closest thing to representation i have, living here in the land of Pelosi, Boxer and Feinstein (not to mention Perata, Migden and Bustamante). Doesn’t mean we can’t make fun of him. Most of you live in normal places where life will go on, but i am not sure i can stand the smugness that will ensue here if the Obamination is Coronated.
Obama’s marching orders will be issued from mansions in Pacific Heights in San Francisco, you can be sure of that.
When Ginsberg croaks i don’t want it’s replacement to be a Soros minion.
May 14th, 2008 at 5:08 PMUsing
Are you fucking shitting me??? From the very limited number of terrorists we’ve subjected to waterboarding we’ve gotten plenty of actionable intel! And please, go beat the “are you saying McShit is a war criminal” strawman somewhere else. I’m not stupid enough to fall for that. What I’m saying is that they tortured him until he broke and did what they wanted him to do: SIGNED A DOCUMENT STATING HE WAS A WAR CRIMINAL. They didn’t want him to believe it deep in his soul. They wanted him to sign it. That’s what he did. The torture worked. Jeeeze!!!! :em41:
Nerby, I don’t believe for a moment McSwine cares about the troops. McSwine cares about the presidency. That’s it. That’s all that fucker wanted since he was old enough to rub one out to the underwear section in the Sears catalog. If he would toss principles aside for political expediency… if he would fuck the GOP and conservatism every chance he got… why in the world would I trust him to command the military? Why in the world would anyone in the military trust him to be their Commander-in-Chief?
Oh, and for those who THINK they can trust McFuckhead’s “oh-so-stellar” Second Amendment record, you might want to look just a bit deeper.
1 - That fucker was in favor of legislation that would have destroyed gun shows in America. By hammering on the non-existent gun show “loophole” he would have required a “special” license to even operate gun shows which the fedgov would be able to deny for any reason at any time.
And his legislation gets even worse… But hey, don’t take my word for it. Read what John Lott has to say:
Oh, and by the way, his attempts to destroy gun shows would have beaten to death a nonexistent problem. Less than 2 percent of guns used in crimes came from flea markets or gun shows, according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics.
2 - This is a guy who appeared in McKelvey’s gun control ads, advocating locking up your tool of self defense.
3 - This is a guy who is fucking FUNDED by George Soros, ferfuckssake!
4 - McCain’s pro-Second Amendment voting record, according to GOA, is a paltry 27 percent. Out of 15 votes relating to the right to keep and bear arms, McShit voted favorably only 4 times. Four.
Here’s his true voting record on gun rights.
Thanks, but no thanks. This fucker is no friend of gun rights, regardless of what his people put out.
May 14th, 2008 at 5:12 PMUsing
I didnt start this Quick did. He savaged me, MuscleDaddy And Nerby over our OPINIONS. ONLY after he started with the invective did I respond likewise. ( and MD and Nerby) You really need to READ the whole thread!
I call your attention to posts #13, 73 and 112. You really need to buy a clue.
May 14th, 2008 at 5:45 PMUsing
Hoghead writes:
First of all Hoghead, if you want to insult me fine, go ahead. Doesn’t help your position though.
Secondly, the first invective was not thrown by Quick. If you had read the entire thread then you would have noticed that it was Muscle Daddy in post #8.
Thirdly, you guys can thrown insults around all you want, I don’t care. What I was referencing was
the assertion that Quick’s line of argument was fallacious was because he had “penis envy”. This is known as argumentum ad hominem.
Insulting someone in a thread like this is somewhat expected (although it tends to weaken the over all argument IMHO), but stooping to ad hominems is like wearing a sign on your back that says “I really have no valid argument to make”.
Cheers,
-B
May 14th, 2008 at 6:09 PMUsing
BEEB sez
Muscle was talking to eyas, NOT QUICK. Quick horned his big snout in and started on MD, then me, then Nerby. I stand by my assertion.
May 14th, 2008 at 6:22 PMUsing
Ah, I see. Quick responds to the previous insult but because it was not directed to him, he is the one that “started this”.
Thanks for clarifying the rules.
And I stand by my statement that resorting to an ad hominem attack is uncalled for.
-B
May 14th, 2008 at 6:29 PMUsing
Fix the machines for sure, and never, NEVER, spit on the military again!.
From link:
Maybe the purple finger ain’t such a bad idea.
May 14th, 2008 at 7:28 PMUsing
Sorry for the hiatus, had to go and work for a living.
Thoughts and methods on resolving illegal entry.
There are no two ways about this, the Southern border must be controlled (as in fencing) and every illegal encouraged to leave by all legal means available. The Norther border is also to be patrolled, maybe with UAV’s and existing checkpints and the good citizens that live there.
Until this takes place all the rest is posturing and hot air.
The housing, hospitality, farming and other service industries will suffer initially but we still have regional unemployment ranges from 4% to 10% that can fill the bill. And yes, some costs will rise, but I would prefer to pay a little more for the product knowing that U.S. citizens are employed and earning more than otherwise.
This has to be market driven. No special government programs or new departments need be created.
The onus has to be on the employer but it is unreasobable to expect them to do this without any resources.
The FBI and local sheriffs office in evey county should have access to a name/SS/fingerprint/photograph search database and that any prospective employee can be asked to submit a copy of his proof, birth certificate, citizenship papers or legal residen card, SS number and a fingerprint which can be taken to down to the nearest office, scanned and checked. Heck, assign a $10.00 fee for the Sheriff office to cover the use of equipment and clerk time.
If it comes back clean they are hireable. And no, this is not an intrusion into your civil liberty. As a citizen or legal resident you have a vested interest in keeping our laws intact and economy strong. So long as the lookup does not make a permanent record of any search that comes up clean, no liberty is infringed. The downside is that when you switch jobs, you may be asked to go through the process again.
If the scan turns up a problem they are turned away from employment with a suggestion that they return home. If no resources to do so and they are clean of crimes on the record, voluntarily turn them selves in within 10 days of the event would earn them passage home on the taxpayer and an ID that would put them on a list, sequentially in the order they come in, to be considered for either migrant work with maxumum presence of 9 months out of 12 (this being only for Mexico) or the can enter the existing que to become immigrants if they have useable skills no matter what country. Not crash in line, but in the normal que with a record of what their skills and desired locale of residence might be.
This should all be workeable with existing resources if there is a physical barrier in place that frees up the border patrol, customs and immigrations to do their jobs.
Of course, all of the above is moot if there is no will either on the part of the citizenry and by their elected representatives. So folks, it comes back to all of us. Either we force the issue or it will continue to fester to the detriment of the entrire national psyche and our long term prosperity.
May 14th, 2008 at 7:36 PMUsing
Muscledaddy -
I don’t think it’s dishonest at all. A consistent theme I see from the “lesser of two evils” crowd is that we MUST vote from McCain to SAVE our nation from being utterly destroyed by Obama/Hillary. As far as I’m concerned, that equates to viewing McCain as our only hope for salvation - hence, Savior. On that point, I say “horseshit!” Obama may take this country to hell in a handbasket, but so will McVain … he’s just a slower deliveryman.
In some respects, I can admit that I may be giving Obama too much credit (esp. in the WOT). Regardless of how ignorant and inept he may be, however, he’s going to be HEAVILY advised (and directed) by other Dems. Some of them do realize that if they screw the pooch and another 9/11 happens on their watch, then they will be thrown out of office and won’t ever regain power. I can definitely see the US losing a lot of ground in eliminating the Islamofuck threat, but I don’t see the apocalyptic visions that some here have painted coming to fruition.
May 14th, 2008 at 7:45 PMUsing
vote “for” McCain … not vote “from” …
May 14th, 2008 at 7:47 PMUsing
Comment by BigDogg
Are you absolutely certain McBackstabber will have slower handbasket-to-hell transit times than Obombya? Personally, I believe it would be a photo finish.
May 14th, 2008 at 8:06 PMUsing
Terrapod, I’ve been to Canada and Mexico. Upon return from Canada, I almost didn’t get back across the border; upon return from Mexico, I walked right across the border and didn’t even need an ID.
So why do we have the northern borders locked up tight, but the southern is a sieve? Never mind. I know the answer.
Deej,
Where I live, we still use pencil and paper. Can’t get much simpler.
May 14th, 2008 at 8:53 PMUsing
DJ,
I always wondered about “calling” a race based merely on exit polls. I’d like to see a moratorium on “calling” an election until all the precincts have reported. This calling it two seconds after the polls close is stupid.
Also, how come *I* never get asked for whom I voted? Not that I would say, but still…
May 14th, 2008 at 8:56 PMUsing
And here I was thinking that maybe I had went to far with my “prison poet” post.
With here a dick, there a dick everywhere a dick dick .. ole McCain had a farm .. E I E I O….
May 14th, 2008 at 9:20 PMUsing
Meanwhile, I read a lot of conservative and military blogs as do many of us here, and I run across post after post of military men who LOATHE McCain. If he supports the military (which I think he does BTW) he clearly does so for his own political expediency. He was a decorated Vietnam vet with a strong story and he has used this to some effect in his political career. He is not going to abandon his brand by NOT supporting the military. That’s what makes him even marginally acceptable to even moderate Republicans. Can anyone here honestly say that if McCain were not strong on national security, that he would even be in this race?
But we all know that McCain really only cares about one thing: McCain. He loves the sound of his own rhetoric more than any politician in Wash DC. This is obvious to all. He loves the adulation of his friends across the aisle and the NYT. He loves being the maverick who can get good press while giving the finger to the base of his own party.
But let’s face it, his position on Iraq was staked out only in recent years to show that he knew better than even Gen. Petraeus on how to run the war. The man is just that egomaniacal and sanctimonious.
So sure, he supports the troops but who is to say he supports the troops in any more circumspect way than he supports global warming? It is all just an act anyway. He is a politician’s politician (only less crafty methinks) and so any position he takes I would take with a grain of salt.
Actually, Misha doesn’t put it that way. He says “thatisall” :em02:
May 14th, 2008 at 9:25 PMUsing
Boss?
How about we drop this whole comments section in the Colosseum?
Things *do* seem to be getting just a wee bit heated and personal hereabouts…
Or is it just me?
Just thinkin’ ’s all…
May 14th, 2008 at 10:12 PMUsing
whoa whoa whoa……
this is getting wayyyyy too heated in here, and it’s all over Mc Cain. Now don’t y’all feel a little silly about all of this?
After all:
I keed…..I keed
May 14th, 2008 at 10:15 PMUsing
From wikipedia:
May 14th, 2008 at 10:35 PMUsing
Why would I want to boil a whole frog? I mean I can see if we were just talking about the legs .. but boil a wholefrog … thats just crazy …. I dont get it. That wikipedia stuff is just way to deep for me … I mean who writes that stuff anyway? Some kind of high falutin college type I bet!
May 14th, 2008 at 10:43 PMUsing
i have the perfect diversion:
Japanese Company Unveils Solar-Powered Bra
May 14th, 2008 at 10:50 PMUsing
Terrible Troy:
you forgot cherry
May 14th, 2008 at 10:55 PMUsing
That’s cuz’ he ain’t never seen one jaybear. :em93:
May 14th, 2008 at 11:07 PMUsing
Whoa! First cuntmuffins … and now solar powered titties…..I am lovin the 21st century and all this technology shit. What will they think of next ?
May 14th, 2008 at 11:09 PMUsing
Roger that 0311.. I likes mine a bit more aahhhh “seasoned” .. yeah thats the ticket.
May 14th, 2008 at 11:11 PMUsing
It’s the yeast in the recipe, all natural and 100% organic.
:em95:
[And yes I do have my finger on the coliseum trap door button for a few denizens hereabouts]
May 14th, 2008 at 11:16 PMUsing
DJ-
umm breakout the lions, tigers and bears, oh my and the popcorn. We just might need the emergency start procedures shortly. No, I didn’t forget the penguins, they’re on strike over the ice, dammitall.
May 14th, 2008 at 11:22 PMUsing
I say we need an Imperial Decree that “cuntmuffin” be officially welcomed to the Rottie Lexicon. Beautiful, just beautiful. Brings a tear to the eye, ya know?
May 14th, 2008 at 11:25 PMUsing
Nicki,
That was the most magnificent sergeantly rant I have ever witnessed, :em69: though truly earned. What you said was a true work fo art. I give you a tip of the boonie hat and a toast. :em03:
May 14th, 2008 at 11:36 PMUsing
I gotta second 0311’s motion. My old man was a taxi driver in NYC when I was a kid…. I can envision him screaming … Hey CUNTMUFFIN! … Get The fuck outta my way !
May 14th, 2008 at 11:39 PMUsing
Beeblebrox, and Nerby, too if she dare come back for another whuppin, And also Hoghead and Muscledaddy, who maybe need to see this,
Many veterans, not only recent but also Viet Nam vets, have serious problems with Mc Cain.
You might want to check out Vietnam veterans Against John Mccain for theri view. That site was assembled by a couple of Vietnam legends - Ted Sampley and “Joe, Certified Gringo Editor”, both of whom i count as friends. Some of the posts at this site will show that among those denigrating Johhie are actual POWs. And also immediate family of some MIAs.This is an issue which causes me, personally, much ambivalence.
I will give McCain at least some credit for not yet personally having tried to pull a Kerry. This speaks to some residual good judgement and other laudable qualities. but when other people, including some idiots here at the Rott (you know who you are), try to invoke it for him, you are doing him no favor and merely demonstratign the curse of having idiot supporters. Should we not query whether you may be truying to provoke a “swiftboating” of McCain?
May 14th, 2008 at 11:56 PMUsing
Uh Oh! I’m sure the left is going to be absolutely up in arms over this fresh attempt to “swift boat” another candidate?
what, they don’t care this time?
May 15th, 2008 at 12:07 AMUsing
No need for MuscleDaddy’s permission to try - one more time - to explain why I (among others) won’t vote for McCain.
It seems to me that those refusing to vote McCain fully understand WHY others WILL vote for McCain, even if they (we) disagree with that rationale.
On the other hand, it seems that those who WILL vote for McCain don’t understand why certain conservatives will refuse to vote for the Republican candidate chosen by liberals, independents, the Leftist media, and the lack of resolve by those who had once run against McCain.
To call the boiling frog analogy dismisses its relevance. You don’t have to agree. You don’t have to believe that there’s any slippery slope involved. But to dismiss the concern as a simple catch-phrase, is to turn the argument into a straw man.
No, the boiling frog analogy is apt, and the slippery slope exists regardless of whether McCain, Obama, or Clinton becomes President.
I was not attempting to suggest that MuscleDaddy is unintelligent. In fact, I’m unsure how suggesting that the relevant decision is similar to the “boiling frog” analogy implies a lack of intelligence by anyone. The post was not addressed to MuscleDaddy to the exclusion of everyone else.
I fear a McCain Presidency only second to a Clinton Presidency. I have NO fear of an Obama Presidency. The man is a putz. By himself, he couldn’t dig any hole with a post-hole digger or a diesel auger. Obama would be the most impotent President in the Nation’s history — he simply doesn’t have the mental horsepower to influence Congress or to defend himself from being used as a tool of a Democrat Congress.
If McCain seems a better option than either Democrat Candidate, or that he would somehow be less damaging to the American economy than a Democrat President, then you did not hear McCain’s speech yesterday pandering to the radical environmentalists and promising action to address the FACT of Global Warming.
Environmental Issues (Global Warming) are not somehow distinct from economic issues. With any Law or enforcement of any kind based on the TRUTH of Global Warming will dwarf any budgetary decisions of a President. Taxes lower — won’t matter. Taxes higher — won’t matter. Dependence on foreign oil — won’t matter. The influence of our Enemies upon our foreign policy will only increase. In short, environmental issues (specifically Global Warming), are no longer secondary issues with limited impact. McCain is a whole-hearted believer in Global Warming and is willing (to mitigate a hoax) to cripple our economy in a way that makes our current economic problems seem a pittance.
Sorry, but McCain is no better than either Dem candidate. He is an absolute disaster in the making. He will experience no greater opposition from a Democrat Congress than either of the Democrat nominees.
Whether I decide to abandon the argument, or continue it, is not subject to MuscleDaddy’s opinions. I respect his opinion — but he’s not the only person addressed by my posts.
May 15th, 2008 at 3:06 AMUsing
Oh, I don’t actually live in a NoVa shithole. I live in the Winchester area - a lot more rural, and I can carry a gun openly anywhere I want and no one freaks out.
Of course I also commute to Bolling AFB every day, which really blows goat.
May 15th, 2008 at 3:15 AMUsing
Nicki, I know the area well, in 04 I lived in Front Royal…. dont envy your commute down Rt. 50, I did the 66 commute…freaking 1.5 hr trip one way on a good day. And I also carried all the time too, I had freaking bears in my yard
May 15th, 2008 at 8:14 AMUsing
[...] linked to this: http://bidinotto.journalspace.com/?entryid=714, which is supplemental to this: http://www.nicedoggie.net/2008/?p=776#comments, which I have rarely(if ever) seen go on for so long, with so much vehemence. Damn, son! I’ll [...]
May 15th, 2008 at 9:01 AMUsing
This is one of three I’ve linked on my site. I hope that maybe someone reads my stuff, and will come here, and to Kims, and to the fella Kims linked to. Damnit! Why can’t we get someone to vote FOR?!?!?!?!
May 15th, 2008 at 9:08 AMUsing
And I second the motion for adoption of “cuntmuffin” as an Imperial insult!
May 15th, 2008 at 9:10 AMUsing
Nicki and Troy:
I live in Fairfax. That commute would drive me crazy. I live 10 minutes away from the office :em69: .
Troy, the commute OUTBOUND on 66 might be worse than the inbound. Some piss poor excuse for a traffic engineer has 4 lanes on 66 (just past Manassas) necking down into 2. Rush hour outbound, from the NRA building to Front Royal is sometimes two hours, now.
BTW, this thread is getting kind long in the tooth, what? I don’t think anyone has accomplished more than learn a few new insults.
May 15th, 2008 at 9:18 AMUsing
Nicki, Terrible Troy
curse you both…..you live in the heart of Civil War country. What I’d give to live within driving distance of all those hallowed fields….the Civil War historian in me would be in heaven. I’m reading a book about the Confederate Army right now, reading about Jackson’s valley campaign and places like Front Royal and Winchester. I’d love to go to those fields and read that part of the book at the place where it happened……..
May 15th, 2008 at 10:19 AMUsing
“>
May 15th, 2008 at 10:40 AMUsing
“>
May 15th, 2008 at 10:41 AMUsing
I don’t mind the commute so much. I-66 at 0530 is pretty peaceful. And the beltway is crowded the other way in the morning. So I take the Wilson across the river, and I’m right there. It’s 90 miles, but I make it, because I love the Winchester area!!! And I carry all the time too! :em96:
May 15th, 2008 at 10:58 AMUsing
Beeblebrox,
If #8 makes your cut for either ‘invective’ or ‘insult’ - you are FAR too delicate to want to hang out here.
Eyas,
In context (there he goes, using the ‘c-word’ again) - I was, to that point, the only one not advocating “Screw McCain, Hand the WH to Obama” - you comment followed mine, so who were you supposed to be responding to - those who already agreed with you?
Bringing up the tired & overused “Boiling Frog” analogy was not the part that I found to be a deliberate attempt to insult my intelligence - no, that would have been the “look it up if you need to” - part.
At this point in history, anyone who would need to “look up” the boiling-frog lives in a wicker basket, without an internet connection or the ability to read at all.
Didn’t think I was being so subtle as to leave you ‘unsure’ as to which part I was referring.
- MuscleDaddy
May 15th, 2008 at 11:01 AMUsing
Evidently (and ironically) you are the one in need of some remedial context identification skills Muscle. You will notice that my complaint (if you can even call it that) was not about who called whom what. That was your problem since you decided to escalate once you were called a name. Fine, like I said before, I don’t care. Insult away if you think it helps.
What I was identifying as “uncalled for” was the ad hominem attack on Quick.
Let me help you with this. Calling someone an “idiot” or an “a$$hole” for believing one thing or another is par for the course around here. OTOH, claiming that someone’s position is wrong because they have “penis envy” (which has to be one of the more juvenile taunts one can toss), just proves you have no intellectual basis for your argument. Resorting to name calling does not necessarily say anything about your ability make an argument.
Nevertheless, if you wish to use ad hominem arguments and thus prove to everyone here that you don’t know how to actually support your stated position, who am I to stop you.
May 15th, 2008 at 12:18 PMUsing
Cheapshot
Thanks a lot for the invite. It was a shame that the Missus and I couldn’t attend the Rottfest this year. We have been talking about a US holiday a lot and it might happen next year, depending on what the crisis is finance/banking has in store for us.
I would really love to see Texas for example, not too excited about NY and CA. And to answer your question, yes I am a beer man through and through. Cannot imagine a proper German guy being any different. And my family was into illicit beer brewing and Schnaps distilling, so I will definitely taste all the way through the results of your craft if you let me.
And I love to teach people some German, I like my mother tongue very much. It’s a difficult language though.
Once again, this is a great place with great people. :em04:
May 15th, 2008 at 12:54 PMUsing
Princess Natasha,
I noticed in the Colosseum you said you were going to be assigned to Engineers after OCS. :em69: Essayons! Princess. Infantry may have more and heavier weapons, but engineers have more explosives. Think of the fun things you can do with C-4 and det cord. We also had more generators, and more pipe and wate purification stuff. So engineers have a better chance of finding a half-human lifestyle.
May 15th, 2008 at 12:55 PMAnd for much of the Army’s history, the Army’s most talented combat leadres were commissioned into the Corps of Engineers, including most of all Marse Bobby Lee. It is Engineers and artillery which distinguish war from a nasty brawl.
Using
Wow Jaybear…I never thought I’d hear words like that out of you!! I am actually shocked! I’ve been away for quite awhile from the comments (just finished my first year of nursing school!) but after reading this entire thread my jaw is on the floor! When we all look past our own principles don’t we become just a flock of fucking SHEEP??? yikes
What actually IS on the line?
Our safety? What good is a WOT when the frickin border is and will remain wide open? I mean seriously. My brother just got back from 15 months in Afcrapistan and the whole time he was there with his life on the line I’m home thinking - what the hell is he fighting for? We’re just gonna let the bastards walk right in the back door. Oh oh oh…that’s right…I forgot - McCain says the border is now secure. What the fuck world is he LIVING IN????
And to echo sentiments here, what the hell is the use of fighting terrorists when our guys’ hands are tied when it comes to eliciting information?? We’ve become a nation of pussies and it’s disgusting, pathetic, and will be our downfall. It makes me sick to my stomach.
As for my principles…those I will NEVER sacrifice! Certainly not for my “party” who has let me down royally by shoving this loser down my throat. John McCain does not have and WILL NOT GET my vote. Period. We can all go round and round here for 200 more comments (now THAT would be fun!! Just like the old days!) but no minds will be changed and the “he started it” shit is getting old but quick - you sound like a bunch of girls…sorry, was that ‘uncalled for’?
May 15th, 2008 at 1:07 PMUsing
ps - Nicki, thank you for your service! My sister and her husband live on Bolling
May 15th, 2008 at 1:10 PMUsing
Welcome Back ima mommy! Been missing your posts. Congrats on getting through that first year of Nursing School!
Exactly!! :em69:
May 15th, 2008 at 1:17 PMUsing
Rush just said it PERFECTLY! People running in the Republican party who are not conservative DESERVE TO LOSE! Cut the dead weight and let’s start over!
DITTO!!
May 15th, 2008 at 1:31 PMUsing
OT: but if you want insane comedy gold check this out. I held my nose and went over to Kayinsane’s. She DID NOT DISAPPOINT! :em95: :em01:
I will check back there because this Bush story (slam at Osama/Obama’s magic touch to talk terrorists into being civilized) should prove insane comedy gold! :em95:
May 15th, 2008 at 2:20 PMUsing
ima mommy,
welcome back my friend…lemme ’splain my position
used to work with a guy who was about as stubborn and beholden to his principles as you could get. NO compromise allowed or accepted, his way or the highway….a lot of our projects came close to failing because he was unwilling to compromise his principles. After a while, the honoring of said principles becomes a very self centered thing and you lose sight of the bigger picture. I too have my principles and have said more than once that Mc Cain is NOT my candidate of choice…..if I hold to my principles what do I do?
write in someone who will never win? thow away my vote doing so?
stay home and ensure that your brother will have obama or clinton as a CinC?
That would be the self centered, principle laden thing to do……
I would rather…..and very reluctantly……vote for Mc Cain, he is a badly flawed candidate but I must vote for him. I have friends in Iraq and Afghanistan, I have to do all I can to keep either one of the surrendercrats from becoming their CinC……must swallow those sacred principles temporarily for the greater effort.
that’s what I meant, and that’s why I will vote for McCain.
God bless you and God Bless your brother and may he come home safe and victorious.
May 15th, 2008 at 2:29 PMUsing
Whoa!!! That bitch is smoking some SERIOUS weed there!
Can you imagine living such a useless, vapid, fantasy driven, miserable life such as that? Just how far removed can someone be from reality and still be able to use a keyboard? :em98:
Damn….she needs some major psychological help. Stat!
May 15th, 2008 at 3:03 PMUsing
Serious, Mrs M. Could see please tell us where the wife of the Solicitor General (and prominent political writer in her own right) Barbara Olsen went?
Where can i get a pound of what she’s smokin’?
May 15th, 2008 at 3:27 PMUsing
Jaybear, I feel ya on the compromise thing - if I worked with that guy I’d label him self-centered as well and would wonder (to his face probably) why he wouldn’t work with the group. On the other hand, the things McCain is asking me to compromise on are waaaaay beyond the pale. I will NOT compromise on the border, amnesty, global warming, torture, etc. These are huge issues!
As for who the CinC will be, I agree with other posters that it really doesn’t matter. Neither of the Dems will rush out of the middle east as it would result in a horrific bloodbath that would be very damaging to their legacies. I guarandamntee you that should one of them win they will get in office and pull the old “Oh geewhiz, now that I’m in office and have access to ALL the information, you are just going to have to trust me that to leave now is not possible blahblahblah…18 months from now maybe blahblahblah…slow withdrawal…” you get the idea. They are all full of shit about the pull the troops out now nonsense. They know it can’t be done and they have each alluded to that fact already in interviews.
So in the end, you’ll hold your nose and vote and I will stay home and until that day neither of us will be convinced otherwise. But it IS good to talk to you again! I’ve missed you Rotties!
May 15th, 2008 at 3:28 PMUsing
DONT VOTE- BUT REMEMBER THIS…………………………………………..‘All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing’
May 15th, 2008 at 3:46 PMUsing
Tell that to the 3,000,000 dead South Vietnamese after the DEMOCRATIC congress cut out their funds and we pulled out our troops.
May 15th, 2008 at 3:49 PMUsing
You don’t think they’ve learned a lesson from that?? That’s exactly what I’m talking about! No prez wants that on their list of accomplishments in office.
May 15th, 2008 at 4:45 PMUsing
And as for the good men doing nothing comment, I propose that we as a party have been doing just that for too long!! Sitting back, doing NOTHING about the limpwristed candidates that have been put before us, and NOT standing up and saying ENOUGH!! That is exactly why we find ourselves in the position we’re in today.
I for one have voted holding my nose too often to do it just one more time because there’s too much at stake. As Misha said they don’t care about my statement of ‘i’m voting for you because you’re the least worst’. They only care that I vote. If I don’t, and enough people join me, then maybe they will begin to get the message. Conservative ideas WIN. period.
May 15th, 2008 at 4:53 PMUsing
I believe the actual original quote was:
‘All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men vote for McCain’
May 15th, 2008 at 5:13 PM:em93:
Using
I’ve gritted my teeth in the voting booth many times as well, to sit home and not vote because you believe it’s the principled thing to do is to hand the office over to a surrendercrat…..if enough principled people do that, then the surrendercrat president will have a surrendercrat Congress with a possible 60 vote majority in the Senate. Try getting anything done doing that…..
I’m voting for McCain for two reasons:
1….The war and our troops
2….possible retirement of at least two Supreme Court judges
now tell me there’s no difference between the presidential candidates.
If you really REALLY cannot vote for Mc Cain, then may I suggest that you at least go vote for the congressional candidates and judges and initiatives on the ballot?
May 15th, 2008 at 5:23 PMUsing
oh and for all you principled “I’m staying home and not voting, or I’m writing in some non-candidate for president” types…..
we should archive this thread and revive it on Jan 20th so we’ll know who to thank when hitlery takes the oath of office. it’ll be your fault, just like it was the fault of all the Perot voters for 8 years of president clinton and her husband……better think about that
May 15th, 2008 at 5:29 PMUsing
a-freakin men
May 15th, 2008 at 5:29 PMUsing
Actually NO I dont. The libs revel in defeat, surrender for “Peace” is a badge of HONOR for them. Youre deluding yourself if you believe otherwise.Obama wants the troops out in 180 days, and damn the consequences. Quite a legacy for our brave fallen heroes. And dead Iraqis.
Surrender. Defeat. Liberal Joy.
“The opinions of LC Hoghead are not necessarily the opinions of all geniuses everywhere, but probably are.”
May 15th, 2008 at 5:36 PMUsing
Agreed but substitute Obamma for Hillary. And I guarantee the slackers will still come in here bitchin and moaning even after they DONT VOTE.They will get the government they deserve.
May 15th, 2008 at 5:42 PMUsing
Jay, Absolutely! But again, your two reasons for the vote are not enough for me! What would lead you to believe that he will appoint conservative judges?? THE MAN IS NOT A CONSERVATIVE!!!
Hog, I’m not delusional. I really believe that as much as he may want them out in 6 months, there’s no way in hell he’s actually going to do it. He talks a good code pink game right now b/c he has to, but when it comes down to it he’s not going to order a hundred thousand troops out at once.
May 15th, 2008 at 5:48 PMUsing
I think we get that from any of the three.
May 15th, 2008 at 5:53 PMUsing
My block quotes are switched, but you get my drift!
[That's what you get for using Vista, hon. (grin)
I fixed it fer ya. -The Management™]
May 15th, 2008 at 5:54 PMUsing
Oh, Jaybear, I never had any problem with that. I have both a Senator and a Congresscritter to vote against.
I just cannot bring myself to encourage, even by passive acquiecence, a man whom I know will destroy something I have worked for all my life. I’m too damn old. I don’t have another 40 years to give.
May 15th, 2008 at 5:57 PMUsing
Well Im still trying to sort through the “fix” to address the fact that the republican party is slipping to the left ala Europe. I think Misha was right on target regarding this and the eventual outcome if nothing is done to stop it. A vote for McCain now does nothing to address this aspect of the problem, in fact it will probably reinforce the behavior. A abstention of a vote fro McCain may very well lead us to 4yrs of dhimmi nonsense, but in the meantime it may ( I stress may ) have the impact of requiring the republican party to return to its “base”.
I think that we are facing many different problems right now and none of them will be fixed in a short term (5 yrs). So in my mind taking a longer term view better serves the ones that I am most concerned with, the next generations. I have a son that is 8 yrs old, I have to think about what his existence will be like when he is an adult. I can tolerate 4 yrs of absolute nonsense (seems Im going to have to one way or other) in hopes that those four years generate a return to balance in this system that is leaning left. But I think a vote for McCain only address the next four years and reinforces this slippage.
May 15th, 2008 at 6:10 PMUsing
Jaybear you know better than that.
I know damn well that nobody here is advocating staying home and not voting at all. I for one have all along said we need to concentrate on Local, State, and Congressional offices. Only by putting in the right people in those places can we hope to stem the leftist slide of the Republicans.
I know it soothes your feelings to think you’re the only ones dedicated enough to go to the polls, while thinking the rest of us are sitting on our asses and not voting at all. Think again. I will be there…..I will vote. I simply will not be throwing the switch on the three Socialists running for the White House.
May 15th, 2008 at 6:20 PMUsing
LC Troy (put it on!)
The Republican Party, overall, has been slipping to the left through simple incrementalism.
That is, every small step the communists get becomes the new baseline for the next negotiation. Every time we compromise, by say, allowing “common sense” gun control, like, forbidding guns within 1000 feet of a school, thew new baseline is Gun Free School Zones, than they start with “no where near a courtroom” and “we ned to register all purchases”, etc.
If, instead of giving in to, say, abortion for the slightest reason, we tell the libruls to go piss up a rope, and draw a line in the sand, the incrementalism will stop.
But, no, the current crop of “Republicans” is more interested in seeing glowing reviews in the Slimes and the Washington ComPost.
I’m through backing up.
Perzactly. Four years of
OsamaObama may cause us all terrible pain. 4 Years of McLame will kill the future for our children.Major difference.
May 15th, 2008 at 6:42 PMUsing
So Jaybear, you are willing to vote to destroy the conservative movement for 1) the troops (who loath McCain because he is a traitor to the cause) who will be just fine without him, and for 2.) the replacement of two liberal judges (probably Ginsburg and Stevens) with two more liberal judges?
Here’s a stark prediction Jay. Hillary is not going to be the the Dem nominee. If McCain is elected, I could see McCain selecting her to be on the SCOTUS to replace Ginsburg. Think about it. The Dems will demand a liberal female to replace the liberal female. Who, on the national scene could fill Ginsburg’s sensible shoes? McCain will appoint her as an olive branch to the Dems and as a way to get continued adulation from the liberal press.
The thing is, you people, who have convinced yourselves (and with good intentions) that McCain is a better choice are being, IMHO, short sighted.
We KNOW McCain loves himself more than the country. We have his voting record to PROVE this. We know that McCain hates conservatives. We know he is a loathsome, old, bitter, little liar. We know he would sell out his grandmother if it got him good copy. \
He is TERRIBLE on national security and I dare anyone to show me where Obama sponsored ANY legislation as damaging to the nation as McCain/Kennedy or McCain/Feingold. And tell me, has Obama sponsored any disastrous for the economy Cap and Trade legislation nonsense lately? Has he sponsored legislation that would kill the American pharmaceutical industry? Has Obama used his first hand experience with torture to dumb down the definition of torture by calling for an end to waterboarding?
I will not vote for Obama but quite honestly, taking the long view, I would rather vote for him over McCain any day. Obama is a tool and will be held in check by the GOP if elected, especially if we vote for conservatives in November. Meanwhile, McCain is a self-centered, low IQ buffoon who will run ruffshod over his own party in order to do deals with the Dems to solidify his legacy.
THIS IS HIS LONG STANDING MO. McCain is not going to change. He is too old, too stubborn, too egomaniacle and too bitter to move back to the right. He is psychologically unqualified to be president and has done NOTHING to show otherwise. Every speech he makes of late proves that he is intent on ultimately going completely left-wing.
His intent is to kill the conservative movement and I, for one, will not participate in the destruction of the only political force in this country that has any hope of saving the future of this nation.
May 15th, 2008 at 8:02 PMUsing
Link
May 15th, 2008 at 8:04 PMUsing
then who will you vote for Mrs. M?? will you waste your vote with a write in or for a third party, just to make a statement?. My bruised feelings have nothing to do with what I said my friend, I’ve seen it posted from a good number of LC’s on this site that they won’t vote this time.
LC Terrible Troy sez:,
would that we had the luxury of 4 years to give….we don’t, we’re at war and a lot of harm can come with the wrong CinC or with a CinC who is beholden to a Soros financed government….we don’t have the time to suffer through a clinton or obama administration hoping that the GOP will find it’s nuts again.
Oh yeah….put that LC on your name man….you’ve been here long enough.
May 15th, 2008 at 8:08 PMUsing
Well, that didnt work worth a tinker’s damn . . .
[It would work just fine if you'd have some actual, you know, text marked that could be used for the hyperlink, brudda. Just sayin', 's all
Fixed it -- Emp.M.]
LC Beeblebrox, exactly right. McCain is a death sentence for conservatism.
May 15th, 2008 at 8:10 PMUsing
It is your OPINION Jaybear that writing in someone like Fred is a “waste” of a vote. I think I can make a pretty compelling case that voting for McCain is a much bigger waste in that it destroys the conservative movement if that vote results in getting McCain elected.
Personally, I am going to do everything I can, short of actually voting for Obama, to make sure that the traitor to the movement, John McCain is defeated. You are thinking tactically, I am thinking strategically. The nation will survive Obama. It will not survive McCain.
May 15th, 2008 at 8:18 PMUsing
where did I say that Beeb? you’re making suppositions that aren’t there. I’d take the moderate picks for SCOTUS that McCain would make over who hitlery or obamama would pick…can you say Justice Reno or Albright or Waxman?? And Obama and the rest of the new liberal majority would be in the pocket of George Soros and MoveOn…..they won’t play games this time around.
I will not vote for Obama but quite honestly, taking the long view, I would rather vote for him over McCain any day. Obama is a tool and will be held in check by the GOP if elected, especially if we vote for conservatives in November. Meanwhile, McCain is a self-centered, low IQ buffoon who will run ruffshod over his own party in order to do deals with the Dems to solidify his legacy.
Kept in check by what GOP? do you not see the landslide coming? we’re already lost 3 special congressional elections and I believe there will be more to come. The GOP has put all of it’s energy on keeping the White House. They are not attacking to regain majorities in the house and senate, they are entrenching…putting their heads down….and hoping that there will be some divine intervention that retains the White House. It will take that divinity to keep the dems from getting a 60 vote majority in the Senate.
It ain’t gonna be McCain who destroys the GOP, it will be the GOP. They are poorly led, ball-less, and have not fielded quality candidates to make a run at taking over a very vulnerable congress….
god help our troops
May 15th, 2008 at 8:21 PMUsing
No it’s not my OPINION, it is a wasted vote, done to massage bruised principles. make the case otherwise sir.
tactics are short term thinking, strategy is long term thinking. Effective tactics lead to a winning Strategy, put an obama in the office with the resultant increased majorities in both houses and you can say goodbye to ANY hopes of a GOP majority for the next 40 years. If you want to vote your principles then do so, for every other race….just please leave the presidential vote blank rather than vote for obama. My “tactical thinking” is to at least have someone in the White House that the NRA can at least talk to, and who won’t use the military aides as waiters at state dinners, and who knows how to salute the Marine Guards properly when he gets off of his Helicopter.
I do not believe that we will win this war if obama or clinton get in there….too much traitorous money behind them.
May 15th, 2008 at 8:30 PMUsing
Am I? Your heart is in the right place Jay but you need to do more than that. You say you are voting for McCain for:
a.) the troops. But the troops have a high disdain for McCain. As has already been pointed out without any viable refutation, Obama is not going to pull out of Iraq any time soon. McCain has recently stated he is going to pull out by the end of his term so, if we are going to take these guys at their words (maybe a mistake), they both will keep the troops there for awhile and then pull them out.
b.) The SCOTUS picks. There is ZERO evidence that McCain will appoint moderates (he WON’T appoint conservatives), and you are forgetting that the Senate has a tacit rule that liberals must be replaced with liberals, moderates with liberals and conservatives with moderates. Assuming that the two liberals leave first, they will be replaced with two more liberals no matter who is Prez.
GUARANTEED.
So you are essentially trading the future of the conservative movement in order to protect the troops (who do not like McCain and will be pulled out of Iraq in 4 years by McCain in any case) and the right of McCain to nominate 2 liberals to the court.
Sorry Jay, McCain is not going to get moderates through the Senate. He is going to pick liberals. Maybe not far leftists but then Obama is not going to pick far leftists either.
Bottom line, sacrificing the future of the movement and thus the country, in order to give John McCain an opportunity to disappoint us once again, is not my idea of a viable bargain.
P.S. Just a reminder that a strong pick for the Veep slot is the ONLY thing that will get me to vote for McCain in November and it will only be with the hope that he does not make it through his first term.
May 15th, 2008 at 8:36 PMUsing
I’ll throw out one of my few and far between serious comments.
I think to paint any thoughtful individuals vote or thoughtful decision to not vote as a waste isnt a correct characterization. They are thoughtfully participating in the process, even if one doesnt agree with thier decisions it is still participation and cannot be wasteful. Every part of the process has an impact no matter how small. In my mind the waste in the process is the umpteen thousands of complete non-participants, those that know nothing of the political process and who dont exercise thier right.
Also Jbear (respectfully) please describe what you fear will happen to the troops under a Obama Admin. And from a military perspective Strategy comes before tactics…. tactics are used to acheive the goals of strategy. But Im probably preaching to the choir on that one….
Im still trying to figure out if its realistic to expect to fix the broken republican party or if another party needs to be created to capture those of us that have been “left behind.”
May 15th, 2008 at 8:46 PMUsing
nor is it mine, but what do you think will happen to the movement if we get obama/clinton and a 60 seat majority democrat senate? All financed by that nazi soros?
I will vote more enthusiastically for him if he gets a good VP……I will vote for him anyway. Like I said before, he ain’t my candidate but he’s all I got.
oh….one more thing, regarding the military not liking him. At least he doesn’t have to make up stories about coming under fire……..wonder how that one went over with our troops.
May 15th, 2008 at 8:54 PMUsing
JayBear writes:
True, but my tactic is to vote for Fred because it works toward the larger strategy, to discourage RINOsim and save the conservative movement.
Voting for McCain is tactical thinking with no long term gain if your goal is to strengthen the country. Instead, it actually works toward the opposite goal. It destroys the country as we know it.
In other words, there is no long term strategic gain in voting for McCain if your goal is to save the conservative movement. In fact, if I were a leftist and wanted to see conservatism defeated, I would vote for McCain.
Wrong, wrong, REALLY badly wrong.
It will not make ANY difference whether Obama or McCain win as far as the make-up of the Congress is concerned. This is a straw man argument and you should know better Jay. McCain loathers like me are not going to stay home so you can stop with that nonsense. We are voting down ticket for conservatives. However, Obama as president strengthens the movement (my goal) while McCain in the WH kills the movement (hopefully not your goal but effectively, the result anyway). This does not mean I will vote for Obama. I want McCain to lose because he lost my vote, not because I voted for his opponent.
The case has been laid out by Misha, myself, Wil, and dozens of others here as to how an Obama presidency helps the conservative movement while McCain kills it. I have heard not one iota of refutation of this scenario.
May 15th, 2008 at 8:55 PMUsing
And one more thing, this thread is not yet to 300.
So, have I mentioned that the Theory of Evolution is a myth and really bad science? :em93:
May 15th, 2008 at 9:03 PMUsing
LC
Terrible Troy:
budget cuts, appointments of politicking generals like Wesley Clark into positions of influence, hugely complicated (more than now) ROE’s designed with a politically correct flavor, cowtowing to UN directives and putting our forces under UN command, and force reductions…..
May 15th, 2008 at 9:03 PMTroy, I say all of that as a military historian and student of politics…I didn’t serve but did work for the Army and DoD for over ten years. I saw how the political game is played with the military and lost my job as a result of clinton’s budget cuts.
Using
in a time of peace yes, I would agree with you….but we don’t have that luxury now. So go ahead and vote for Fred or Rudy or whoever, but remember this:
the 2000 presidential election was determined by 500 votes in Florida. Only 500, but it was enough to give the electorals to Bush and put him over the top.
only 500 votes man……still want to throw yours away?
May 15th, 2008 at 9:09 PMUsing
ima mommy, thank you. I still get a little blushy and floored when people thank me for my service. It’s a warm fuzzy, but I keep thinking, “What the heck are you thanking me for? I’m thankful every day that this nation accepted me and gave me the opportunities I could never have gotten if I’d remained in the former USSR.”
Bolling is a nice base, I’m finding out. For the longest time I felt like one of those weird spooks who is locked up in a SCIF and then scampers home. Just office and home - that’s it. Like an obsessed nerd. I finally got out a few days ago to take a look around. :em93:
May 15th, 2008 at 9:16 PMUsing
Let me say this only One. More. Time.
A vote for McCain is a vote to kill the conservative movement. Ergo, I am not “throwing it away”. I DON’T WANT MCCAIN TO WIN.
Understand? He needs to lose for the good of the nation. If he wins, the next president will be Hillary (unless McCain has already appointed her to the SCOTUS) but the difference is, by 2012 McCain will have destroyed the movement and she will have free reign as she starts her first of 5 terms.
Remember, McCain hates conservatives. If he is going to win, he needs to win without us.
May 15th, 2008 at 9:21 PMUsing
God forbid that I should make you repeat yourself :em93:
and you think that a win by obama or clinton will rejuvenate it? If you have a problem with McCain-Feingold just wait until a democrat president and solid dem majority congress strenghten that bill and pass a fairness doctrine on top of it……then wait until a liberal SCOTUS decides to review the 2nd Amendment……who does the NRA talk to? do you think they’d be invited to an obama whitehouse?
500 votes……..
May 15th, 2008 at 9:37 PMUsing
Jay .. I well remember the Clintons admins impact, many of my friends that were senior NCO’s got riffed. Wiped out our whole experienced supervisory capacity. I remember our humint intelligence capability being dessimated. I remember the Somali debacle. Current ROE’s are already to warm and fuzzy for me (but thats another area). But we are looking at two sides of the same coin, who’s to say after the draw down under a McCain strategery we wont see a similar scenario (especially regarding the UN) . If we are going to approach this decision process from this perspective I think that we can agree that the GWOT will still be there in a strengthened form no matter who is in charge. With that in mind is it better to condemn the troops to four years of nonsense or potentially twenty years… and what impact would that have on the greatest threat to our species which is radical islam? So many factors to consider… is there a long term value to be recieved if we were to fall back, & suffer the idiginity of another attack, inorder for this prevailing nonsensical thinking among some regarding our ability to co-exist with this threat to be defeated once and for all?
May 15th, 2008 at 9:49 PMUsing
the movement is full of myopic assholes……….we are doomed if they succeed
May 15th, 2008 at 9:52 PMUsing
ALL HAIL PRESIDENT OBAMA AND THE LIBERAL CONGRESS AND SUPREME COURT> CONSERVATIVE IDEAS WILL NEVER BE HEARD FOR 50 YEARS.
May 15th, 2008 at 9:54 PMUsing
MAY GOD FORGIVE OUR MYOPIC “CONSERVATIVES” and MAY OUR CHILDREN ALSO, FOR 50 YEARS OF LIBERAL RULE
May 15th, 2008 at 9:55 PMUsing